Transplants with Finasteride or Minoxidil?

[nooc]

First, let me say that I am new to this site. I have been aware of a slowly receding hair line of mine for years, but I just chalked it up to aging. But this past weekend, I had my panic attack. Looking in the mirror, I realized that I was also thinning quite a bit on top. I freaked, especially after looking at my slightly younger brothers and mid-60 year old father and realizing that they still have thick heads of hair. So, I'm guessing something genetically is different with me (mom, is there something you want to tell me?).

So, after finding this site and doing a lot of reading and research this past weekend, I'm thinking that the only true way to regrow hair is with a transplant. After talking to a friend of mine who just had an hair transplant, he loves it. And I thought, cool, I'll go do it. However, he also told me that the surgeon "recommended" he takes Finasteride as well.

Let me tell you, Finasteride does scare me, and I'll tell you why. People are different and different things work for them. So, if Finasteride isn't working for you, it doesn't mean the product sucks, it just sucks for you. But I am very concerned with the side effects, because a) I don't trust the FDA and b) whenever I take an oral medication, I always seem to suffer from the side effects.

Remember Accutane? That wonder acne-drug? I took it. It didn't work. It made my skin worse. One of the warnings was that it may induce hair loss. Ha! Back when I was 25 taking it, I had lots of hair. What did I have to worry about? Now at 36, I am the only one in my family to be thinning. And also the only one to have tried Accutane. In fact, I think that's actually when I may have first started to notice my thinning. But it's been the past two years that it has gotten a little worse.

Regardless of that, I don't generally like taking oral drugs for anything, not even a headache or stuffy nose. I'm guessing taking Finasteride after and hair transplant is to maintain the remainder of your natural hair on top. But if that's the case, couldn't you also use Minoxidil for that purpose? Has anyone done that or know of anyone who has?

BTW, this is a very informative forum and I like how everyone supports everyone.

 

[misterium]

I had extremely bad acne all over my face and chest/back/shoulders, from ages 16 - 19.

Then I found out about Accutane, and was prescribed the highest strength dosage. After about 4 months, I had no more acne and my skin was healing beautifully.

That was then. I'm 27 years old now and haven't had a pimple since.

I don't think it caused my crown to start thinning all these years later... but that's just my situation.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

I had a ton of transplants in the very early days. It's a hard thing to recommend, cause whatever space you want to fill up now, other spaces will eventually lose hair as well, and you'll be 'chasing' your baldness, right into the poorhouse.

Please be very careful before you make that decision.
it's a long term headache. Some get lucky, but...

That said, I did finasteride and minoxidil. I was only on the finasteride for about a year and half, and I hated having to keep refilling prescriptions, etc. (I was dividing it in 5ths, cause i didn't want to take a whole mg.

I noticed my chest was becoming puffier, like gyno was slowly setting in. Nothing sexual. No loss there. And at the same time I was doing minoxidil twice a day.

So I quit propecia after a year and a half, went to minoxidil just once a day, and began doing advanced scalp exercises. That's where I am today.

I wouldn't recommend getting started with anything, if you can possibly make peace with it. It's a lifelong commitment, as well as roller-coaster. I'm in my 50's, and it's consumed way too much of my life.

 

[extremekicks]

Midnight hows the scalp exercises working out for you? How long have you been doing them?

B

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Probably 2 and half to 3 years. I do them my way. on a slant board, while exercising, pilates-style. About 20 minutes each a day. Then about 10 minutes each night. After that, I do the min. dosage.

It took close to 2 years to really see that I was doing AS well with the excercises, if not better, than I was on Propecia. and 2 doses on Min.
So it's really, really slow going, the first 2 years.

I've regrown a lot of hair in the middle and back area, and the front is just in way better shape.

 

[extremekicks]

I would have to think some form of massage def helps the blood flow which in turn will help hair follicles. Almost like getting a massage for the body helps muscles recover, toxins into the lymphs, and gets old blood flowing more

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Regardless of that, I don't generally like taking oral drugs for anything, not even a headache or stuffy nose. I'm guessing taking Finasteride after and hair transplant is to maintain the remainder of your natural hair on top. But if that's the case, couldn't you also use Minoxidil for that purpose? Has anyone done that or know of anyone who has?

Yeah, you wouldn't need finasteride. After hair transplants, minoxidil would be all you'd need...at first! :roll: There's this little matter of 'shock fallout' which they never tell you about. Meaning that after you get the hair transplants it will facilitate the loss of more hair, due to the shock.

More loss= more money for them, which is why they won't tell you. :evil:

 

[nooc]

I'm curious, Midnight, what do you mean when you say you had your first hair transplant done in the "early days"? What was your age or how long ago was it? I'm wondering if the technology has changed a lot since then.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

I'm curious, Midnight, what do you mean when you say you had your first hair transplant done in the "early days"? What was your age or how long ago was it? I'm wondering if the technology has changed a lot since then.

Believe it or not, it was 1975. I was 25. Bosley himself did the first procedure. The plugs were bigger back then, and through the years they've made them smaller, until they now do single follicular transplants. The technology at the moment seems to suggest that transplants would look better and more natural, but you still have the 'big' problem that you only have so much donor hair, and that won't be near enough to finish the job. Cloning hair is the only real solution, and that's far away right now.

If I was going to do it over, and had a ton of money, I might consider booking a flight to Australia and hiring Dr. Woods to do the hair transplants

Either that, or join a Buddhist monestary until I reached enlightenment, and then hairloss wouldn't be such a problem. :lol:

 

[socks]

I'm guessing taking Finasteride after and hair transplant is to maintain the remainder of your natural hair on top. But if that's the case, couldn't you also use Minoxidil for that purpose? Has anyone done that or know of anyone who has?

Nooc,

No!

Finasteride inhibits the 5ar thus reducing DHT. Minoxidil has no effect on DHT. Minoxidil does augment your existing hairs, possibly regrow some dormant hair, and extend the growing cycle of your hair... However, this is just an artificial cosmetic improvement that is dependent on continued minoxidil use... Once you stop minoxidil the results go bye bye and fast. In addition, since minoxidil isnt actually protecting the hair, just creating an "offset", your hair will continue to get worse.

Minoxidil is good to use with a drug like Finasteride but it isnt a good idea to use it by itself IMO.


Finasteride is a safe drug and does the job. I suggest getting on Finasteride and using Nizoral 2% shampoo every 2nd - 3rd day. Not only will this help you maintain the hair you have, it will make any hair transplant that you get in the future last that much longer!

If you get a hair transplant and dont go on meds then you will continue to thin in the non-hair transplant areas and will eventually need more hair transplant... You only have so much donor area and if you are destined to naturally become a Norwood 6 - 7 then, w/o meds, you will have a ridiculous looking scalp with patches of hair, bald spots, and scars.


Either commit to meds and a hair transplant or accept Mother Nature's plan bud.


Good luck.

 

[Hairport]

I plan on getting an hair transplant and I won't be touching finasteride. If I pay the consequences so be it -- i'll get a piece or something.

 

[socks]

Hairport,

May I ask why you came to the conclusion you did in regard to Finasteride? I sincerely hope it isnt based on any of the garbage "panic posts" that gets posted on the Internet bro...

The "official" studies done on Finasteride show it to be a safe drug with some of the lowest and most minor occurrence of side-effects out there... Did you try it and get a reaction of some kind?

 

[nooc]

Socks

Thanks for the honest replies. I appreciate them.

Yes, I personally am quite paranoid about this type of drug. I still remember Thalidomide that was prescribed to pregnant women in the 50's and resulted in all those deformed babies. Recently there was talk about Accutane causing birth defects. Or course, there have been hundreds of drugs released that don't cause birth defects ...

As far as finasteride goes, I don't think there are any documented cases of any birth defects - and I hope there aren't. But, when it comes to this sort of thing, I'd like to err on the side of caution. I'm looking forward to having children, and just want to make sure they don't suffer because of something stupid I do. Therefore, if I can avoid finasteride altogether, especially with an hair transplant, I will.

Of course I would not like to spend a lot of money, but I would rather spend money on surgery than a drug with potential unknown side effects. I am prepared to continue to spend money on further hair transplants if I have to (and actually had planned to if I continued to thin out). However, I didn't know about the finite amount of donar hair. I'm sure it's different with everyone, but do you know where I can find info on the average amount of donar hair we have (I will check the articles on this site)?

The futhest anyone has gone in my family was my grandfather and uncle who were Norwood 6s. If I go that far and look ridiculous with hair patches all over my head, I'll just shave it and get a tattoo to cover my scar(s) so I look like a really cool old dude. Hopefully, there will be hair cloning and hair stem cells by then.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

However, I didn't know about the finite amount of donar hair. I'm sure it's different with everyone, but do you know where I can find info on the average amount of donar hair we have (I will check the articles on this site)?

But you don't know how much hair you're destined to lose, so you can never be sure how many grafts you might need. If you just have a bald spot in the rear and that seems to be the extent of it, then for sure you'd have enough donor hair.

You probably should have a consultation with a hair transplant doctor, but be warned: they'll say anything to get you in that chair.

 

[socks]

Yes, I personally am quite paranoid about this type of drug. I still remember Thalidomide that was prescribed to pregnant women in the 50's and resulted in all those deformed babies. Recently there was talk about Accutane causing birth defects. Or course, there have been hundreds of drugs released that don't cause birth defects ...

As far as finasteride goes, I don't think there are any documented cases of any birth defects - and I hope there aren't. But, when it comes to this sort of thing, I'd like to err on the side of caution. I'm looking forward to having children, and just want to make sure they don't suffer because of something stupid I do. Therefore, if I can avoid finasteride altogether, especially with an hair transplant, I will.

From the research I did, Merck had to inject 100x + of a normal Finasteride dose directly into the womb of test monkeys to cause any birth defect.

While drugs have been passed by the FDA that has ended up causing unknown/unforeseen problems, the vast majority of FDA approved drugs are as "safe" as they are advertised to be.

Picking out a few examples of drugs that caused unknown/unforeseen problems as a rationale to avoid FDA approved drugs is sorta like avoiding driving cause some car models have been known to be lemons that ended up causing injuries!

Dont get me wrong, I respect your right to make your own decisions on what to do and what not to do with your body... I myself rarely take medication unless I really need it... I just dont believe in popping pills like skittles :wink:

However, when one does have a condition that can be rectified via science and wishes that condition rectified then I think you owe it to yourself to be objective and fair in your assessment of such treatment.


IMO, and from the data that is available on Finasteride, finasteride is a safe drug that is well tolerated by 98% of men! That is an incredible statistic that can sometimes be lost on one when one visits a Internet forum that is a breeding ground for paranoia, panic, and mental disorders!

Not to say that Internet forums such as HairLossTalk.com arent invaluable and rich in information but one should first do independent research before seeking the amateur opinions of those of us who make up these discussion boards.

Of course I would not like to spend a lot of money, but I would rather spend money on surgery than a drug with potential unknown side effects. I am prepared to continue to spend money on further hair transplants if I have to (and actually had planned to if I continued to thin out). However, I didn't know about the finite amount of donar hair. I'm sure it's different with everyone, but do you know where I can find info on the average amount of donar hair we have (I will check the articles on this site)?

As MidnightFlyer suggested, the best person to give that assessment would be a ethical and well regarded hair transplant Doctor. I would advise you to check out the Surgical Hair Restoration - Hair Transplant Open Topic at HLH for some excellent reading (Click here for the HLH Forums)

 

[MidnightFlyer]

this was taken from the aforementioned hairloss site. It's good stuff.

The word “Elvis†should be banned from hairloss sites. Once you have male pattern baldness, you need to accept that Elvis is dead, quite dead, and not coming back. Hair transplants CANNOT restore your hair to what it was before male pattern baldness began. Ever. No matter what doctor you go to, no matter how much you pay. It is IMPOSSIBLE to transplant enough hair to restore original density. Period.

I’ve been seeing a lot of posts recently from guys who appear not to understand this fact. A lot of these posters are young guys with fresh memories of their lush, teenage manes. Those days and those manes are GONE. While medications like finasteride and minoxidil can (often) help you maintain your current haircounts, always remember that male pattern baldness is a relentlessly progressive disorder. It is also highly variable. If you are experiencing significant hairloss in your teens or early twenties, it is likely that you will wind up with substantial hairloss. You may well go completely bald; you will almost certainly reach NW3 and be seen as balding. You cannot predict the course of male pattern baldness.

I think a bunch of newbies, many of them young guys, have started to look into hair transplant as a result of seeing pictures on the web. This is a big, big problem. You like the *pictures* of someone’s results? here is my recommendation. Go see him IN-PERSON. Then you will know why only people *without male pattern baldness* can use the word “Elvis.†There is no “Elvis,†no “NW1,†no “original density†for people with male pattern baldness. No hair transplant can EVER accomplish these dreams, and this becomes esp. obvious when you see guys with hair transplant who were the victims of advanced loss. The best it can do is restore an *illusion* of hair, an *illusion* of coverage. You will NOT understand this from looking at hair transplant pictures online! This cannot be over-stressed!

It is tempting, in these days of aggressive hair transplant docs and profoundly misleading pictures, for a young guy to begin the process of hair transplant. So it is important that the basic facts regarding the LIMITATIONS of hair transplant be routinely posted for newbies. There is always a fresh crew on the verge of a costly mistake, and this kind of mistake can cost more than money. If male pattern baldness has made you unhappy enough to even think about hair transplant surgery, then you need to realize that an ill-advised hair transplant could literally ruin your life.

In sum, everyone considering hair transplant must research *extensively.* Do not rely on pictures. See as many patients as possible in-person. You will be surprised at the high-noon limitations of even the finest hair transplant. It may not be a pleasant surprise. After a great deal of research on boards like these, and at least one official, extended, in-person consultation with an elite, ethical hair transplant doctor, you will be better prepared to grasp the reality of hair transplant. That reality is: with *very conservative expectations,* a person with good hair-characteristics, who visits one of the elite, ethical surgeons, may possibly achieve a reasonable illusion of hair coverage in limited areas where he was formerly bald or balding.

Elvis has left the building and is NEVER coming back. Period

 

[nooc]

Actually, I've already got a consultation with Hasson & Wong (in Vancouver) on Monday. That's where my friend went. He said they were great and very helpful. He was very put off by the Bosley people.

Oh, and I'm not expecting to look like I did when I was twenty (unless The Flock of Seagulls look is coming back - no lie, I had it in two-tones!). I expect to still look like a 36 year old man (wow, I'm a man?). I don't want to lower my hairline. I just want to fill out the thinning.

I'll see what Dr. Wong has to say. But keep the comments coming. It helps a lot to hear from from normal people.

 

[sherwood]

must say...that might be the most adequate/truthful/realistic/correct description of what to expect from male pattern baldness and hence hair transplant's. It does seem like people just assume that they will fight the battle and when it gets bad enough...as long as money isnt an issue...they will return to their glory days when they get their hair transplant...not true...so crucial that people including myself love what they have today because Today is the best your hair will ever look again... have u ever looked at pics of years back when u were paranoid and depressed bout thinning and think now wow i had nothn to worry bout i looked fine....well it is best to learn from that and do your best to understand that today is that day u will look back upon and say id kill for that hair...it is all in perception and none is tuffer critic than ourselves...and no one has more altered perception about ourselves than ourselves...enjoy today..carly simon said it best...these are the good ol days....we all feel pretty cheated when we are checking out of this place and realize our lives were heavily dictated and our actions affected by a 10 inch section on the top of our heads....fight the fight...do what u can but keep things in perspective...and always realize two things...u never look as good as u think u do....but u never look as bad as u think u do either...goes both ways...peace

 

[socks]

Nooc,

Let us know what Dr. Wong says (including his opinion on you using meds).


Good luck man, I wish ya the best!


Sherwood,

You are absolutely 100% correct sir!