Topical Dutasteride And Microneedling Study

pegasus2

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pegasus2

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Sorry, two posts, as if it makes a difference. The point is I'm not going around disliking all of your posts just because I have a problem with you. I disliked the posts that I would have disliked regardless of who posted it.
 

dietcoke1987

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They don't give any information about the vehicle. Dutasteride has a molecular weight of 528 g/mol so penetration is not certain. I wouldn't waste my money or effort on any topical dutasteride unless it was proven that it could achieve significant absorption.

I think the point is Dutasteride is supposed to be more hydrophobic and lipophilic than finesteride which means it will want to stay put in the local area of application in the skin than go into the blood stream and go systematic. I don't know why this isn't being brought up that's the most relevant reason to use topical dutasteride. Seems like a very worthy reason to look into. There was a post awhile back where a doctor was offering injections of dutasteride in the scalp that only needed to be done every few months for example. Also the daltons of the molecule at what is it 450 for max common size for absorption is a rough standard, don't get caught up on it. The shape of the molecule also plays a very important role. Hyaluranic acid for example is a large molecule but penetrates because it's long and slender. Also we know much larger molecules can penetrate through the hair shaft channel. This was brought up in the lactoferrin study since that is also a larger molecule and they had results showing it was absorbing. So it seems like there is potential topical dutasteride may be one of the best and safest methods for addressing scalp DHT, should be a lot more of a conversation taking place on it.
 

dietcoke1987

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Injections are one thing, I have seen no evidence that dutasteride can penetrade the skin. There are rare exceptions to the 500 Dalton rule, but where is the evidence that dutasteride is one of those exceptions? If it is then why didn't Polichem choose dutasteride for their topical instead of finasteride? That would've made more sense if it was possible.

I really don't care. It's a pretty irrelevant concern from my perspective. There are many ways to bypass it by way of carrier formulation or application or skin prep. Also beyond all of that none is needed by way of the follicle channel which I already brought up. Lactoferrin is something like 80 000 daltons which is significantly larger needless to say. A liposome formulation alone completely solves the issue and I believe was how one of the topical dutasteride formulations was made if I remember correctly.
 

pegasus2

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I really don't care. It's a pretty irrelevant concern from my perspective. There are many ways to bypass it by way of carrier formulation or application or skin prep. Also beyond all of that none is needed by way of the follicle channel which I already brought up. Lactoferrin is something like 80 000 daltons which is significantly larger needless to say. A liposome formulation alone completely solves the issue and I believe was how one of the topical dutasteride formulations was made if I remember correctly.

The only way to circumvent the properties of the corneal layer is by disrupting it, for example with ultrasound, a method also known as phonopheresis (2), or with high-voltage electrical pulsing, also known as electroporation (3, 4). Alternative methods such as stripping the corneal layer using adhesive tape have also been advocated but are not reliable. The use of skin penetration enhancers such as dimethylsulphoxide or carriers such as liposomes have never been confirmed to make a difference.
https://www.fitgelatins.com/500Da.pdf
 

dietcoke1987

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The only way to circumvent the properties of the corneal layer is by disrupting it, for example with ultrasound, a method also known as phonopheresis (2), or with high-voltage electrical pulsing, also known as electroporation (3, 4). Alternative methods such as stripping the corneal layer using adhesive tape have also been advocated but are not reliable. The use of skin penetration enhancers such as dimethylsulphoxide or carriers such as liposomes have never been confirmed to make a difference.
https://www.fitgelatins.com/500Da.pdf

Exactly, like I said there are a multitude of ways to bypass the 450/500 dalton rule of thumb and many more since two decades ago. There obviously has been a lot of research into liposomes in the last two decades since your cited paper far less in the cosmetic industry alone.

https://www.longdom.org/open-access/penetration-enhancement-techniques-1920-4159-1000235.pdf
https://sci-hub.tw/10.1007/s00403-011-1166-4
 

pegasus2

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Exactly, like I said there are a multitude of ways to bypass the 450/500 dalton rule of thumb and many more since two decades ago. There obviously has been a lot of research into liposomes in the last two decades since your cited paper far less in the cosmetic industry alone.

https://www.longdom.org/open-access/penetration-enhancement-techniques-1920-4159-1000235.pdf
https://sci-hub.tw/10.1007/s00403-011-1166-4

If you really believe that then get yourself some topical dutasteride. I'm sure some of it will be absorbed, but most of it will go wasted.
 

dietcoke1987

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If you really believe that then get yourself some topical dutasteride. I'm sure some of it will be absorbed, but most of it will go wasted.
Who said I haven't already? I wasn't exactly ever fishing for your approval lol, just pointing out penetration clearly isn't an issue like you believe. Even assuming minimal efforts are used for limited penetration, it's tendency to stay localized with extremely long half life will give localized accumulation. Which also makes that largely a non issue.
 

Xander94

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Who said I haven't already? I wasn't exactly ever fishing for your approval lol, just pointing out penetration clearly isn't an issue like you believe. Even assuming minimal efforts are used for limited penetration, it's tendency to stay localized with extremely long half life will give localized accumulation. Which also makes that largely a non issue.
any results ?
 
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