To anybody who has made a topical before

player77

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Hi i have the 60ml bottles of revivogen.
I also have the 1mg propecia pills

Will it discolve and work if i crush the propecia pills into the revivogen bottles and use it that way as a topical??

If yes how many 1mg pills would i need to crush into 1 bottle to make the strength .05% propecia?

Help would be greatly appreciated
 

CCS

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60mL
0.05%
how many 1mg needed?

OK, 1gram = 1000mg
10mg in 1mL = 1%
600mg in 60mL = 1%
0.05*600 = 30 1mg pills.

So a 1 month supply of propecia put in your 60 mL bottle will get you 0.05%.

As for it working, or not giving side effects, that I don't know. Still costs a bit though.
 

player77

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30 pills? just for such a low strength is that accurate?

i was under the impression people put in 1 - 3 pills in there formulas.

Anybody here had results using 1 propecia pill per 60ml bottle of minoxidol or revivogen ???
 

follicle84

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I think making topicals is too much work and hassle. I tried to dissolve 1mg of finasteride in my 5% minoxidil with alzelaic acid and fukd it up. It didnt dissolve well and i didnt fully know what i was doing. You have to know about measurements, volume, temperatures, delivery vehicles it will dissolve in etc when making a successfull topical.

You can probably buy topicals like this already made why not get them instead?
 

Bryan

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follicle84 said:
I think making topicals is too much work and hassle. I tried to dissolve 1mg of finasteride in my 5% minoxidil with alzelaic acid and fukd it up. It didnt dissolve well...

How do you know it didn't dissolve well?? You _do_ know that the vast majority of a Propecia tablet consists of various fillers and excipients, and it's the tablet fillers and excipients (not the active drug) that generally don't dissolve very well, right? :)
 

follicle84

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Well im no chemist, but i thought it would be just as simple as just throwing 1mg (broken into four peices) of finestride (propecia) in my xandrox 5% bottle (minoxidil- no ppg +azelaic acid) i got from doctor lee. I read that you can get minoxidil with finestride in a solution and thought i'd attempt to make my own without looking to deep into how its done.

Well it didnt dissolve well and that was well over a month ago. So its my guess somethings missing and it not as straight forward as what i had done.

To update on this it is dissolving just at a very slow pace which wasnt expected. Brian do these fillers and excipients that form the propecia tablet need to be dissolved aswell to enable finestride to dissolve into the solution or doesnt it matter. I personally believe it does to release the finestride from inside it, but im no expert on such things. If so how would one dissolve these fillers and excipients that form the propecia tablet to enable finestride to dissolve into the minoxidil solution.
 

ali777

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I have dissolved finasteride in alcohol just out of curiosity. I had a few ml's of vodka in a small container and I threw couple of finasteride tablets in it. Then I let the vodka do its thing. In a few hours the tablets were all soft and very easy to mix.
 

CCS

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player77 said:
30 pills? just for such a low strength is that accurate?

i was under the impression people put in 1 - 3 pills in there formulas.

Anybody here had results using 1 propecia pill per 60ml bottle of minoxidol or revivogen ???

Just so you know, 1% in 60mL is 600mg. 1 gram (1000mg) in 100mL is 1%. Propecia is only 1mg. I'd advise you to get Fincar, 5mg.
 

CCS

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Bryan said:
follicle84 said:
I think making topicals is too much work and hassle. I tried to dissolve 1mg of finasteride in my 5% minoxidil with alzelaic acid and fukd it up. It didnt dissolve well...

How do you know it didn't dissolve well?? You _do_ know that the vast majority of a Propecia tablet consists of various fillers and excipients, and it's the tablet fillers and excipients (not the active drug) that generally don't dissolve very well, right? :)

He's right. I also read that finasteride breaks down in water in 4 weeks, but might be more stable at lower pH. Either way, do not make more than 1 month at a time.
 

CCS

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follicle84 said:
Brian do these fillers and excipients that form the propecia tablet need to be dissolved aswell to enable finestride to dissolve into the solution or doesnt it matter.

The filler just needs to fall apart into a powder at the bottom. If you still see 4 pieces, the finasteride might not have leached out.
 

CCS

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ali777 said:
I have dissolved finasteride in alcohol just out of curiosity. I had a few ml's of vodka in a small container and I threw couple of finasteride tablets in it. Then I let the vodka do its thing. In a few hours the tablets were all soft and very easy to mix.

Sounds great. I heard a vehicle used that gave good results in one small study was 25% water, 50% alcohol, and 25% propylene glycol. Another company tried to optimize the topical, and found a different ratio and some other stuff, but it was not super different from this one. I don't remember the ratios.
 

Bryan

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follicle84 said:
To update on this it is dissolving just at a very slow pace which wasnt expected. Brian do these fillers and excipients that form the propecia tablet need to be dissolved aswell to enable finestride to dissolve into the solution or doesnt it matter. I personally believe it does to release the finestride from inside it, but im no expert on such things. If so how would one dissolve these fillers and excipients that form the propecia tablet to enable finestride to dissolve into the minoxidil solution.

They don't necessarily have to be dissolved along with the finasteride, they just basically need to be finely powdered so that the finasteride inside can be exposed to the vehicle, and be dissolved. If you're going to be experimenting with topical finasteride, I STRONGLY recommend that you finely powder those tablets in something like a mortar and pestle, or if you don't have that, maybe crush them into a powder with a spoon, against a hard glass or metal surface. Then toss the powder into your liquid vehicle, and stir or shake thoroughly. The internal finasteride should be exposed to the vehicle that way, and dissolved after a reasonable period of time.
 

follicle84

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Good input. I guess i was being a little niave with my experiment assuming the alcohol and water content would easilly dissolve 1mg of finasteride so easilly. Thanks Brian
 

patagonia

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what I do is get a piece of "aluminum foil wrap"(the kind used in the kitchen for food etc) .... (a piece of plastic can work too, like a zipblock bag type)

make a small square with the foil and put the "finasteride" pills inside and then fold to cover them with the foil.... (seal the sides so powder stays in when u crush)

then carefully crush them with a hammer.... (do it lightly to not rip foil causing finasteride powder to spill out)

perfect pill powder this way..... use it to season your minoxidil, shampoo... etc
 

follicle84

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Brian how important is alcohol in minoxidil? I understand it is used to dissolve minoxidil and used as a delivery vehicle for penetrating the scalp to enabling more effective absorbtion. The problem lies with the drying effect left on the skin which can cause inflammation rendering it counter productive to some level. The reason i ask is someone claims to have made there minoxidil more effective by letting the alcohol content evaporate and still managed to get results.

http://jefffsbeardboard.yuku.com/to...echnique-Convert-regular-to-7-no-alcohol.html

The only way i can see this happen is that once it has dissolved the minoxidil lies saturated within the ppg and doesnt evaporate with the alcohol as quickly. Of course some of the minoxidil will evaporate with the alcohol but a lot of it will be left as a residue of mainly minoxidil saturated within ppg (effectivelly increasing the concentration of minoxidil). Now with the alcohol evaporated i suspect it will effect the level of absorbtion when applied to the scalp despite the increased concentration of minoxidil.

A company that uses one of doctor proctors ingredients (SOD's) in the brand name of nanogaine claims that there product acts the same way as minoxidil but without the harsh side effects and alcohol. Check link below.

http://www.nanogen.co.uk/res_websit...y&supplierCode=PANGAEA&cat1=134&productId=236

Another site gives an explantion of how this is possible.


It means that yes the solution dries/penetrates more
slowly but it does not dry out the hair.

Liposomal questions -

This is a fair and incisive comment/observation made by one of your readers but is not relevant to this
particular product for two reasons:

1) Capilarity - If this was any other part of the skin, the benefits
of a liposomal vehicle for improved transcutaneous absorption of an aqueous solution is unquestionable.

However this is not the same for hair products. The reason why is that Nanogaine actives are designed
to travel to the hair folicle itself.

Fortunately, normal, thinning and even vellus hair is present in what appears to be smooth/bald areas
acts as a direct transport system to the follicle using the physical and powerful priniciple of capilarity.

The same mechanism that drives water up through narrow channels from the base to the leaves of 100m
metre tall trees without any power source.


It also makes some bold claims about minoxidil possibly worsening hairloss by opening channels which could allow more dht to reach the follicles.


The mechanism of action of Minoxidil has nothing to do with its vasodilatory
effects as is commonly and incorrectly stated by pseudo-scientists.


That is increasing access to blood supply. You would be amazed at the number of so-called hair loss
experts who still band around the concept that Minoxidil 'works' by increasing the blood supply
available to the hair follicle.

In fact the increase in blood supply as a consequence of the vasodilatory effect of minoxidil is an
unfortunate side-effect that probably reduces its hair regrowth effects to a large degree.

The last thing one wants to do is increase the amount of DHT presenting to hair follicle cells that
are genetically predisposed to 'die' when they are exposed to DHT.


Taken from

http://stophairlossnow.ipbhost.com/lofiversion/index.php/t14.html


Now if this is true then not only is nanogaine a safe alternative that offers the same bennefits as minoxidil. Alcohol in minoxidil may not be needed as much once minoxidil is already dissolved in the solution. It can be absorbed through the hair which acts as a direct transporter to the follicle providing it doesnt evaporate too quickly which it wont due to the ppg keeping IT saturated on the scalp (long enough for it to be absorbed to take effect). The bottom line is this alcohol's only use at this point is to further penetrate the scalp.

My question is this do you think such as solution (nanogaine and minoxidil) will work without alcohol. Im thinking nanogaine exagerates its ability to penetrate the scalp without alcohol. I understand skin is semi permeable and is needed to be to enable us to sweat. So i guess its possible but i doubt it will be effective enough without the use of alcohol to take any real effect.

The reason i am asking such questions is i am considering mixing nanogaine with minoxidil so that the alcohol can enable nanogaine to have more effective penetration into the scalp. The result of which i hope will be more impressive hair regrowth with less scalp drying and inflammation. I understand this will weaken the minoxidil so i am thinking of using 5% minoxidil 50% diluted with 2% Nanogaine. If im correct that should bring the minoxidil solution down to 2.5% with 1% Sod'S and copper peptides (apparently nanogaine has copper peptides according to the third url link).

Inaddition to this im thinking of dissolving finestride into the solution before mixing it with nanogaine after everyones instructions on how to do it. Im thinking of using five 1mg propecia pills into the solution. Why might i do this you might thinking. I cant full tollerate propecia internally (gyno) and have many pills left over i dont want to waste. Further more im a choosing to use 5 pills instead of one because various sources tell me topical finasteride isnt effective enough because not enough finestride penetrates the scalp. Its my guess that by increasing the concentration of finestride into the solution it will increase the probability of enough finestride penetrating the scalp to take a more noticeable effect.

Of course this is just an idea and im not going to try it until i know more about it. If it turns out alcohol isnt really needed there wont be much point in mixing both nanogaine and minoxidil as i can just use them separatelly. The idea is just to increase the absorbtion power of nanogaine with some added extras.

Do you think such a solution could work?
 
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