The Best Androgenetic Alopecia Regrow Stack For H2 2018?

[drop]

Hey guys, given all the progress that happened in the hair loss research over the past 5+ years (especially around Wnt/β-catenin pathway, prostaglandins, growth factors, etc) what do you think is the best "stack" for regrowth as we go into the H2 2018?

Let's say for typical Androgenetic Alopecia NW4 man barely maintaining on Big3+dermarolling, wanting to improve but avoid hair transplant. $2k+/month budget. What would be your bet?

 

[Falsenine]

Finasteride
Minoxidil
Niazoral

 

[inmyhead]

Finasteride
Minoxidil
Niazoral

+ dermarolling

 

[vegetassj]

Ye its still big 3

 

[drop]

Ok, so far you guys are saying that things like PTD-DBM, DMN-VPA, WAY-316606, Zinc, Seti, PGE2, Magnesium L-Threonate, Thymulin, S-Equol etc. will either provide no benefits or won't be worth the side effects, right?

(I understand that for a couple of them this is still just a theoretical question because we just started experimenting with them, but still... based on the research data we have what would be your best guess?)

 

[Hate da Bt]

Ok, so far you guys are saying that things like PTD-DBM, DMN-VPA, WAY-316606, Zinc, Seti, PGE2, Magnesium L-Threonate, Thymulin, S-Equol etc. will either provide no benefits or won't be worth the side effects, right?

(I understand that for a couple of them this is still just a theoretical question because we just started experimenting with them, but still... based on the research data we have what would be your best guess?)

S-Equol has already been tested and no satisfactory results were yielded.

 

[Mykonas]

S-Equol has been already tested and no satisfactory results were yielded.

i disagree

 

[INT]

S-Equol has been already tested and no satisfactory results were yielded.

S-Equol has barely been tested

 

[BalderBaldyBald]

No fap

 

[Hate da Bt]

S-Equol has barely been tested

There are threads even here, in HairLossTalk.com, dating back in the early 2010's.
There have been treatments with S-Equol being their primary ingredient and all have been met with poor results.

 

[INT]

There are threads even here, in HairLossTalk.com, dating back in the early 2010's.
There have been treatments with S-Equol being its primary ingredient and all have been met with poor results.

Believe me, I have done a lot of research on s-equlol and its potential efficacy and yes, there are a lot of topics on it but there are barely any people that properly tested it.

 

[Seuxin]

The best stack is :

Minoxidil+Adenosine+Tretinoin+Melatonin+Methyl Vaniliate
+Dermaroller
+Castor oil
+Pge2
+Fevipiprant
+Dutasteride
+AHK-CU
+GHK-CU
+Nizoral
+Stemoxydine
+VPA


GO !

 

[Btg]

Almost nothing is ever tested properly by non- professionals , even if the cure was already tested it could have been labeled as inefficient.People cant determine the dosage nor the vehicle, not to comment on the fact that alot of guys use products for mere weeks and say they are garbage. your best shot is to read articles or at least blog entries , find what you believe has potential and use it for 6 + months

 

[furrydome]

You have to try some things to figure out what "stack" works best for you, but the core ingredients are:

1. An aggressive maintenance treatment. Something that stops the inflammatory cascade. Lots of options, none good. Side effects usually the big roadblock
   1. finasteride/dutasteride
   2. RU or other topical antiandrogens, including Equol (see here)
      
   3. Seti/Fevi (see here)
   4. Zinc+B6 aka Zix - Probably not aggressive enough, but lots of people say it's helping
   5. Antihistamine - Cetirizine was shown to help in studies, but not a lot of positive results on the forums. Could be that it isn't stable in any vehicle. Desloratidine is promising because it's more stable and in the same class as Cetirizine, but not a lot of info available
      
   6. Estrogens - This is really extreme for maintenance, but this guy has achieved it + regrowth
2. A way to stimulate regrowth. The more of these you do, the better:
   1. Wounding - Almost nobody gets regrowth without wounding. You want microneedling, NOT dermarolling. Those rollers shred your scalp extra hard for no benefit, but give you greater risk of infections and scarring. Spread the word, people.
      1. Typical regimen seems to be 1.5mm every week or two, but it's been said that going deeper is much more effective. My experience with 2.0mm seems to back this up.
   2. Minoxidil - Almost always part of a wounding regimen. If you apply too soon after wounding, a lot more drug goes systemic - people have reported bags under the eyes and wrinkles on the face. No conclusive evidence, but the science says it's possible. Better to wait 24hrs+
   3. WNT agonist - Common one is Lithium Chloride (LiCl) 10mg LiCl/1mg water applied while the wound is fresh. Nobody seems to have a solid answer as to the safety or effectiveness of these. Some speculation that this can cause cancer.
      
   4. Topical PGE2 - Applied to light wounds (some info here). Supposedly has a massive growth stimulation effect.
      
   5. Estrogens - Small amounts used topically can help regrowth (see here)

Regarding other stuff mentioned:
Ketoconazole / Nizoral - Part of the "big 3" but I've noticed exactly zero results from this
PTD-DBM - Too new, still being trialed
DMN-VPA - Is just VPA in the form of dissolvable needles that are injected. PTD-DBM and VPA are being trialed on the forums
WAY-316606 - Related to Cyclosporine A, which we know works, but has nasty side effects. Pretty new, doesn't seem like anyone's trialing it yet
Thymulin - Supposedly bodybuilders have grown hair when injecting the stuff, but a commercialized topical just hit the market a few days ago. No solid results yet

 

[Renegade000]

You have to try some things to figure out what "stack" works best for you, but the core ingredients are:

1. An aggressive maintenance treatment. Something that stops the inflammatory cascade. Lots of options, none good. Side effects usually the big roadblock
   1. finasteride/dutasteride
   2. RU or other topical antiandrogens, including Equol (see here)
      
   3. Seti/Fevi (see here)
   4. Zinc+B6 aka Zix - Probably not aggressive enough, but lots of people say it's helping
   5. Antihistamine - Cetirizine was shown to help in studies, but not a lot of positive results on the forums. Could be that it isn't stable in any vehicle. Desloratidine is promising because it's more stable and in the same class as Cetirizine, but not a lot of info available
      
   6. Estrogens - This is really extreme for maintenance, but this guy has achieved it + regrowth
2. A way to stimulate regrowth. The more of these you do, the better:
   1. Wounding - Almost nobody gets regrowth without wounding. You want microneedling, NOT dermarolling. Those rollers shred your scalp extra hard for no benefit, but give you greater risk of infections and scarring. Spread the word, people.
      1. Typical regimen seems to be 1.5mm every week or two, but it's been said that going deeper is much more effective. My experience with 2.0mm seems to back this up.
   2. Minoxidil - Almost always part of a wounding regimen. If you apply too soon after wounding, a lot more drug goes systemic - people have reported bags under the eyes and wrinkles on the face. No conclusive evidence, but the science says it's possible. Better to wait 24hrs+
   3. WNT agonist - Common one is Lithium Chloride (LiCl) 10mg LiCl/1mg water applied while the wound is fresh. Nobody seems to have a solid answer as to the safety or effectiveness of these. Some speculation that this can cause cancer.
      
   4. Topical PGE2 - Applied to light wounds (some info here). Supposedly has a massive growth stimulation effect.
      
   5. Estrogens - Small amounts used topically can help regrowth (see here)

Regarding other stuff mentioned:
Ketoconazole / Nizoral - Part of the "big 3" but I've noticed exactly zero results from this
PTD-DBM - Too new, still being trialed
DMN-VPA - Is just VPA in the form of dissolvable needles that are injected. PTD-DBM and VPA are being trialed on the forums
WAY-316606 - Related to Cyclosporine A, which we know works, but has nasty side effects. Pretty new, doesn't seem like anyone's trialing it yet
Thymulin - Supposedly bodybuilders have grown hair when injecting the stuff, but a commercialized topical just hit the market a few days ago. No solid results yet

Thanks. What do you use for microneedling? I’m using a dermaroller 1.5mm at the moment.

My hair is in better shape since I started 2 months ago but that might be due to other factors.

 

[cocona]

The best stack is :

Minoxidil+Adenosine+Tretinoin+Melatonin+Methyl Vaniliate
+Dermaroller
+Castor oil
+Pge2
+Fevipiprant
+Dutasteride
+AHK-CU
+GHK-CU
+Nizoral
+Stemoxydine
+VPA


GO !

Good stack:

Toss a SRFP1 Inhib on that and you are g2g. Also Microneedling like others mentioned.

 

[kiwipilu]

@furrydome where did you read this? I doubt 10mg of licl once a week or once every other week in water vehicle is harmful; is it? In this paper: (https://tinyurl.com/yc4qbywt) there are a couple of words about lithium chloride so this does not come out of nowhere. but f*** knows where they had their informations about it or how they came to the conclusion licl might help . I would like to know more but it's like an unicorn. anyone ??? any link to a study?
btw microneedling = dermarolling.

 

[furrydome]

Thanks. What do you use for microneedling? I’m using a dermaroller 1.5mm at the moment.

My hair is in better shape since I started 2 months ago but that might be due to other factors.

I use a Derminator and like it because the depth is adjustable and the replacement needles are cheap, but dermastamps are simpler and also pretty cheap.

My hair was definitely showing results after adding wounding (1.5mm every 2 weeks) at the 2 month point, so wounding might be working for you.

Also "rolling" vs "needling" or whatever you want to call them:

 

[furrydome]

@furrydome where did you read this? I doubt 10mg of licl once a week or once every other week in water vehicle is harmful; is it? In this paper: (https://tinyurl.com/yc4qbywt) there are a couple of words about lithium chloride so this does not come out of nowhere. but f*** knows where they had their informations about it or how they came to the conclusion licl might help . I would like to know more but it's like an unicorn. anyone ??? any link to a study?

Here's a decent discussion about WNT signaling. From a quote in that thread:

While Wnt regulates normal epithelial stem cell renewal, aberrant Wnt signaling can contribute to cancerous growth

Another possible nugget of gold from @InBeforeTheCure:

Rapamycin was able to prevent a lot of the DNA damage response, but not all of it. The mTOR activation they attribute to inhibition of GSK3. GSK3 positively phosphorylates TSC2, which inhibits mTORC1 activity. I guess people should be cautious about overusing GSK3beta inhibitors like LiCl and VPA for this reason -- it might backfire.

 

[bluecyclone]

Surprised no one has mentioned oral minoxidil.

I’m failing fast on RU going to try this stack:

1mg (Brand) Propecia 3x week or topical (trying to get the lipsomal no luck)
2.5 Oral Minoxidil daily
RU 60mg in 6ml Stemox every day

Thoughts? No stamping because of oral not topical minoxidil. Might try Keto again but didn’t have much luck and hair felt horrible. Issue is diffuse and now starting to loose hairline.