Studies On Finasteride's Effect On High Estradiol Levels

[zixxiz]

I started a thread among General discussions the other day, but now I realize that it might've been a better fit for 'Tell your story' as it's quite lengthy. 26yo, diffuse thinner, hair falling out constantly for 18 months.

Anyway, I had my hormones checked recently and the results came back with Estradiol levels near the higher end of the reference values. That is worrying as I've read that Propecia raises both T and E by approx. 15%. I've been trying to find some finasteride studies that experimented with guys with high estrogen levels, but no luck so far. Also, almost no anecdotal reports online as well. Does this just mean that it's not advisable at all to try finasteride for guys like me? Should I make an effort to lower my E levels via drugs or diet?

I guess there must be someone out there who was in my shoes at some point. I have scheduled an endocrinologist appointment, but that'll be like a month from now.

Thanks in advance

 

[Janekoman12]

Diet

 

[Grasshüpfer]

You either get sides or you don't and it either works or it doesn't.

There is no reason in trying to anticipate the result.

 

[mghrs]

honestly I dont think anybody would be without sides on peopecia. no one wants to say: hey , i kept my hair but I killed my D. 75% drop in serum DHT a potent androgen in the body and also acts as an anti estrogen. there will always be sides. maybe some dont notice it, mayb it is a function of time, maybe dont want to admit it or v**** works great. the least one can get from reduced DHT is a feminized brain or ruined their brain some how. it is just doesnt add up that reducing this much DHT wont do anything in 95% of the people.think about it if you put more DHT in your body, you wouldnt get any sides ? why lowering it wouldnt give you sides then? propecia reports very few people experienced sides, but studies on effect of low dht show a lot of changes in the body. 98% of T is bound SHBG which renders it inactive. SHBG is actually lower in balding people. this makes DHT the primary androgen in all of the body except muscle. it will certainly have effect on muscle development but not as much compared to T. Propecia may keep you hair nut it is certainly wouldnt do it without a price.

 

[Netsky]

Ive avoided propecia threads for years because of the unhelpfulness of anecdotal opinion but I've been off propecia for two months now and the general difference in my personality is obvious to people who don't know or didn't know that I was taking (low) doses of propecia.

I seem to have more energy during the day and am able to train in the gym to a decent level. I have no doubt that propecia slowed my hair loss but now I'm passed 30 I hope that the rate of my loss will slow down somewhat. Just like most of us I'm crying out for a decent treatment that will just stabilise my loss without affecting my hormones. My only real hope is replicell everything else is just smoke and mirrors to me.

Been looking into SMP as I shave my head these days but for every decent result I see, I see 3 or 4 that look awful and the last thing I want to do is look stupid.

I really hope new treatments are coming out but I've been on here for 5 years (which is nothing compared to others) and the science just doesn't seem to be quite there even if it may have made some decent theoretical progress.

FeEl free to ask me any questions

 

[zixxiz]

@mghrs thanks for the reply, I agree with you - in the long run there have to be some side effects if you're going to mess with your hormones

@Netsky thanks for your reply. what was your dosage on finasteride? and how did it work re regrowth? and I agree, SMP is like an optical illusion..once you see it for what it is - you can't unsee it

 

[wannamyhairback]

I started a thread among General discussions the other day, but now I realize that it might've been a better fit for 'Tell your story' as it's quite lengthy. 26yo, diffuse thinner, hair falling out constantly for 18 months.

Anyway, I had my hormones checked recently and the results came back with Estradiol levels near the higher end of the reference values. That is worrying as I've read that Propecia raises both T and E by approx. 15%. I've been trying to find some finasteride studies that experimented with guys with high estrogen levels, but no luck so far. Also, almost no anecdotal reports online as well. Does this just mean that it's not advisable at all to try finasteride for guys like me? Should I make an effort to lower my E levels via drugs or diet?

I guess there must be someone out there who was in my shoes at some point. I have scheduled an endocrinologist appointment, but that'll be like a month from now.

Thanks in advance

man now i am in your position. I have ben using propecia for last 10 months,i have observed very first symptoms of gyno, maybe i am being paranoid, so got my estradiol checked its 55 pg/ml where it should be between 20-47, i am afraif of taking aromatese inhibitor as it wll be much harder to maintain good balance , what did you do?

 

[Min0]

man get off that sh*t, check out PGD2 inhibitors like seti if you have the money.
finasteride was a mistake.

 

[dr75]

Lose weight if you are not fit. That should help.

 

[d3nt3dsh0v3l]

man now i am in your position. I have ben using propecia for last 10 months,i have observed very first symptoms of gyno, maybe i am being paranoid, so got my estradiol checked its 55 pg/ml where it should be between 20-47, i am afraif of taking aromatese inhibitor as it wll be much harder to maintain good balance , what did you do?

Pls don't take AI. A SERM, for example nolvadex/tamoxifen, is not good for you (side effects can affect vision and stuff - seriously, look it up; nobody in the bodybuilding community takes nolva for extended periods of time). And letrozole is a suicide inhibitor like finasteride, except for aromatase instead of 5-AR. We know how steep the dose response is when you use a suicide inhibitor to kill the enzyme. You'll tank your E2 if you take letro (>90% decrease). Again, nobody in the bodybuilding community takes letro for long term - it's the last resort nuke to kill budding gyno before it gets out of control. Letro is known for bad sides during that time too, like shitty joints and ED. And don't even start about lower doses. Again, similar to finasteride, dose response is steep, etc.

Pls b safe bb ;_;

 

[Feelsbadman.jpg]

And letrozole is a suicide inhibitor

Nope. It's non-steroidal and non-suicidal.

 

[dralex]

honestly I dont think anybody would be without sides on peopecia. no one wants to say: hey , i kept my hair but I killed my D. 75% drop in serum DHT a potent androgen in the body and also acts as an anti estrogen. there will always be sides. maybe some dont notice it, mayb it is a function of time, maybe dont want to admit it or v**** works great. the least one can get from reduced DHT is a feminized brain or ruined their brain some how. it is just doesnt add up that reducing this much DHT wont do anything in 95% of the people.think about it if you put more DHT in your body, you wouldnt get any sides ? why lowering it wouldnt give you sides then? propecia reports very few people experienced sides, but studies on effect of low dht show a lot of changes in the body. 98% of T is bound SHBG which renders it inactive. SHBG is actually lower in balding people. this makes DHT the primary androgen in all of the body except muscle. it will certainly have effect on muscle development but not as much compared to T. Propecia may keep you hair nut it is certainly wouldnt do it without a price.

I disagree with you. There is no studies showing that lowered DHT causes side effects in all people. In fact they show the opposite. 5Ar2 inhibitors have a biological model. These people born with this deficiency didn't sexually develop as males but had no other long-term health problems. 5AR2 is necessary for sexual development, but beyond that it is unknown. Whether it's needed as an adult is unknown, but studies primarily show that it isn't needed, and many people actually report an increased sex drive and libido. Studies for the most part have shown its safety and efficacy. Most people who use this argument that everyone is experiencing side effects on finasteride are usually people who are trying to convince themselves that finasteride isn't and never was a viable option, as they begin to look more and more like George Constanza, when just taking the pill probs wouldn't have given them any sides and would have potentially kept their hair for the rest of their lives.

Also there is a study on people who took anabolic steroids with finasteride and dutasteride and those who took steroids without. There was no difference in muscular development between the 3 groups. DHT does not affect muscular development and actually suppressing it results in greater testosterone which can increase muscular development.

 

[Feelsbadman.jpg]

DHT does not affect muscular development and actually suppressing it results in greater testosterone which can increase muscular development.

Agree with your post 100% but this little bit is especially true. What people don't seem to realize is that DHT actually suppresses Testosterone. By inhibiting DHT, you are in a sense removing the restraint on T production.

High DHT and high Estradiol will equal low testosterone. With high levels of sex steroids, the brains feedback mechanism will stop sending signals to the testes to make more T. DHT does not inhibit estrogen production. It is not an aromatase inhibitor. It simply cannot be converted to estrogen so if you are converting all of your T to DHT then yes, it prevents estrogen formation but this situation is horrible for your health. It will leave with low T, highly androgenic, and catabolic as Testosterone is the primary androgen that has anabolic effects (muscle growth) not DHT.

High Testosterone equals low DHT and low Estradiol. For T to be high, the strongest inhibitors of luteinizing hormone (hormone that triggers T production in testes) must be low. Progesterone inhibits both DHT and Estradiol. High T and High Progesterone go hand in hand. This is the hormone profile of young healthy males.

Progesterone inhibits 5AR to an extent but DHT and 5AR have a feed forward mechanism, meaning the more DHT present, the more 5AR is produced and vice versa. High levels of 5 alpha reductase deplete progesterone (by converting it into 5α-dihydroprogesterone which then converts to allopregnanolone) and eventually lead to a hormone profile of high DHT, potentially high estradiol, and low T. This andropause. male hormonal aging. Finasteride and Dutasteride prevent this.

 

[d3nt3dsh0v3l]

Nope. It's non-steroidal and non-suicidal.

I stand corrected. The man's right. Aromasin is the suicide AI. letro and arimidex are not suicidal.