Spironolactone Is Exhausting ... Switching To Cyproterone

[IdealForehead]

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[folfoxorack]

50mg cypro is way too much. Always take the lowest dose possible. Start with 12.5mg every 2-3 days. After a month decide to stay with it or increase dose.

 

[folfoxorack]

Hahahaha f*****g LOLed.

Thanks buddy. But too late, already in my stomach, that ship has sailed.

Maybe I'll do 1/2 tablet tomorrow, but probably not. Guys with prostate cancer take 200-300 mg a day routinely.

Trannies use 50-150 mg which is essentially what I'm aiming for since this is not a long term solution but rather just for a few months until I get something else sorted out.

Hopefully I don't get a blood clot and die.

You'll know if I never post again.

Trans often take only 12.5mg every other day.
I’m not saying you’re going to die. In a long terme use it can be harmful if you take 50 daily.
You can do whatever you want but avoid high dose if you’re going to take it several years.

 

[DHTpolice]

Hahahaha f*****g LOLed.

Thanks buddy. But too late, already in my stomach, that ship has sailed.

Maybe I'll do 1/2 tablet tomorrow, but probably not. Guys with prostate cancer take 200-300 mg a day routinely.

Trannies use 50-150 mg which is essentially what I'm aiming for since this is not a long term solution but rather just for a few months until I get something else sorted out.

Hopefully I don't get a blood clot and die.

You'll know if I never post again.

Yes, 50 mg for your goals is way too much. Mtf usually take 12.5-25 mg a day and their T is undetectable.

 

[DHTpolice]

Yeah but from what I see that's if they're good responders and taking estrogen too. For no estrogen you need more. Even then on most forums I see mtf taking 50 mg or more.

As stated the castration dose for men without estrogen is 200-300 my per day.

I'll keep the potential for lower does in mind. Yesterday was the first day I had real erectile dysfunction since I started spironolactone.

I get why people freak out about it. It's no fun. Still hoping I can stop all this in a week or two even once I get my daro.

It's funny when some people think they experience bad sexual side effects from finasteride. Those pussies should try spironolactone for comparison, lol.

Be prepared that sexual side effects from Cypro would be much worse. Most probably you would experience constant dull testicular pain and impaired spermatogenesis at the beginning.

 

[folfoxorack]

Yeah but from what I see that's if they're good responders and taking estrogen too. For no estrogen you need more. Even then on most forums I see mtf taking 50 mg or more.

As stated the castration dose for men without estrogen is 200-300 my per day.

I'll keep the potential for lower does in mind. Yesterday was the first day I had real erectile dysfunction since I started spironolactone.

I get why people freak out about it. It's no fun. Still hoping I can stop all this in a week or two even once I get my daro.

You’re doing a big mistake and you’re wrong 12.5mg is enough. 200-300 mg a day...
Its your body ... good luck.

 

[FutureSaitama]

Do you guys still have a libido ? Can you masturbate or have sex ? Not trying to be a dick, i'm genuinely curios.

 

[folfoxorack]

Do you guys still have a libido ? Can you masturbate or have sex ? Not trying to be a dick, i'm genuinely curios.

My testosterone is now at range of physical castration level ... but I have stronger libido than with 2mg of dutasteride ... sometimes I cant stop thinking about sex ... it's weird. I can masturbate.

 

[IdealForehead]

Just found this article from 1972:

1. A psychopathic male with uncontrollable and deviant sexual behaviour (homosexuality, attempted incest, fetishism, transvestism) was treated with the antiandrogen using cyproterone acetate 100 mg per day—for three weeks. After four days plasma testosterone levels (basal 9 a.m. and 6 p.m. and during masturbation—pre, immediate post, and 30 mins. post) had dropped by approximately 50 per cent; clinically both erectile and ejaculatory capacity and `libido' (sexual feelings, tension, fantasies, etc.) were reduced, the former to a much greater extent than the latter. Both clinical and endocrine effects were completely reversible eight weeks after discontinuing the drug.

2. Two other cases (a homosexual and a ` hypersexual') studied clinically showed complete suppression of sexual responsiveness (`physiological' and `libido') on doses ranging from 50 mg/day–150 mg/day; the effects were reversible on stopping the drug.

3. In addition to the action on sexual feelings and functioning, all patients noted a general tranquillizing effect.

 

[AnxiousAndy]

It's funny when some people think they experience bad sexual side effects from finasteride. Those pussies should try spironolactone for comparison, lol.

Agreed. finasteride sexual sides are blown way out of proportion by some people. When i was on 150mg of spironolactone i couldn't get a solid errection, my dick grew but it was floppy and pretty useless in bed. Once i stopped things went back to normal pretty quick. I wish i had a better response to spironolactone i just shed like hell.. but it did do wonders for my skin and scalp.
@IdealForehead Why are you on such an extreme regime? Drop the spironolactone its pretty much useless while on cypoterone. Up your oral minoxidil dosage to 5mg twice a day. Also, what age and norwood are you?

 

[yourworld001]

Hahahaha f*****g LOLed.

Thanks buddy. But too late, already in my stomach, that ship has sailed.

Maybe I'll do 1/2 tablet tomorrow, but probably not. Guys with prostate cancer take 200-300 mg a day routinely.

Trannies use 50-150 mg which is essentially what I'm aiming for since this is not a long term solution but rather just for a few months until I get something else sorted out.

Hopefully I don't get a blood clot and die.

You'll know if I never post again.

What about your bone density when your test is nuked, its why trannies have to have take Estrogen to keep their bone density normal

 

[AnxiousAndy]

What about your bone density when your test is nuked, its why trannies have to have take Estrogen to keep their bone density normal

But he will have great hair

 

[yourworld001]

But he will have great hair

And be in a wheelchair when your bones start to crumble.

 

[AnxiousAndy]

And be in a wheelchair when your bones start to crumble.

Who cares if your body is fucked when you have a flowing mane atop your head? I respect ideal forehead for his decisions. If loniten doesnt give me the results im looking for i will definitely give his regime a go.

 

[AnxiousAndy]

Cool to see someone else on here who has tried a more aggressive regimen. Thanks for the pointers. Okay, I'm dropping spironolactone. I'm on such an extreme regimen because:

1) finasteride and dutasteride literally do nothing to me - my DHT doesn't budge at all on them.
2) RU58841 has slowed my loss down but I do think it's still progressing after two years on it.
3) I have a freakishly high forehead from birth, and although I'm technically probably only a bad NW2 probably at this stage, I really can't afford it with such a bad hairline to begin with.
4) I'm in the middle of a forehead reduction procedure with scalp expander already implanted and need to get it done by the end of winter, because I can hide a balloon in winter with a beanie Ashton Kutcher style, but I'm not going to be able to hide it once spring comes.

It's a real clusterfuck because I probably should have delayed my forehead reduction until a year of being on a GOOD regimen, but I didn't realize (or allow myself to realize) that RU was failing me until I already got the expander put in. Kind of fucked myself. Now I'm on a very tight time frame to optimize my hairline as best I can before the procedure, which I'll probably have to finish by February.

My dick was starting to fail at the end on spironolactone 200 mg daily. On cyproterone 50 mg at least so far it seems to be working fine. Took 100 mg cypro today just for good measure because I'm surprised by how well it's still working and would rather more aggressive androgen blockade. I don't care if I have ED right now.

I tried many times to take 5 mg minoxidil twice daily but it gives me awful headaches. Vasodilator effect. At 2.5 mg twice daily though I'm fine. Plus I'm using topical minoxidil, so practically, I should be pretty maxed on minoxidil.

I'm mid 30s and I've gradually been receding at the corners for about 10 years. I've been lucky it's been so slow. My dad aggressively balded in his teens. Poor bastard. I always though that would be me too. So I've already done better than expected I suppose.

But I really just want to experience life with a good hairline and no anxiety about it moving or changing. Perhaps that's unrealistic, but it's still my hope that with everything done and a steady daro dose I can have that for once in my life. I've hated my hairline since I was 10 years old. It would be nice not to feel that way at least once.

It sounds like for all your efforts it is paying off, but hair greed gets to the best of us most times. Is your forehead really that bad you are getting reduction surgery? Why not spend it on a hair transplant? I have a high hairline myself so it makes me look quite bald with my Norwood 2.5 at 20 I do seem to be making progress as far as regrowth goes so i hope things stay thay way. finasteride did nothing for me either but make me worse! So im not going to entertain the idea of trying dutasteride lol. I recommend you get on B6 and Zinc supplements, both are good for hair and have some solid science backing it up, my supply arrived yesterday so i hope i see something positive from it.

 

[AnxiousAndy]

I had a very abnormally high hairline even before I lost a follicle.

From the center of around where my juvenile hairline used to be to my nasion (the point of greatest indentation at where your nose starts between your eyes) measures just under 10 cm. This is simply too big for a forehead.

It needs to be at least 2.5 cm lower to be "normal big", and I'm aiming 3-3.5 cm lower to get a nice proportion.

I almost had a transplant to try to fix it but luckily ducked out at the last second when I read about forehead reduction. Transplants at most can provide 50-60 units/cm2 which would be probably half my natural density. Plus it would have wasted thousands of my donor grafts for a shitty result.

Much better to get the reduction and then transplant a few hundred to cover the scar after if needed.

I don't regret that decision at all. I'm very happy with it so far. I just regret the fact that finasteride, dutasteride, and RU have all failed me to varying extents, because I lost 4 years of hair in the process of trying them and now I'm scrambling to find something that works mid procedure. Sucks being a "hard case".

That sucks also that you are so far along at such a young age. My sincere hope (and I also hope I'm not just being overly optimistic) for all us hard cases as I keep saying is that topical darolutamide becomes cheap fast and works as well as the numbers predict.

Honestly if it doesn't, I'm pretty fucked because I've got nothing else to try, and I can't take cypro forever. You might unfortunately end up in the same boat if finasteride/dutasteride are out of the question. I doubt RU would save you completely if you're going that fast so young, though it's worth a try. in my case RU solved ~70% of my scalp itch and definitely slowed things down.

I'm taking a pretty big load of supplements already but why not - I'll pick up some zinc and B6 too. Can't hurt. Thanks.

10cm is quite a forehead i'll admit, mine is 8cm i think but its been a while since i measured it. Yeah it sucks dealing with it at 20.. i actually started receding when i was 14 but it was slow and gradual, finasteride doubled maybe even tripled the speed to the point where the change was visually noticable every 2 months and i deteriorated from a norwood 2 to a norwood 2.5 in 9 months! Im fairly sure the oral minoxidil has halted the process for now, im even getting some regrowth too. There are a boatload of anti androgens to try, its just a matter of finding and using an effective, penetrating vehicle for them. Supplements are good, i should have been taking them long ago.

 

[AnxiousAndy]

I don't honestly understand how it's biologically possible for someone's hairloss to worsen on finasteride.

Is the theory that by suppressing your DHT, your follicles become more sensitive to androgens (by upregulating receptors), and your testosterone increases, so overall you get a net negative result?

That's the most plausible mechanism I can conceive of.

What's your plan for antiandrogen therapy long term? Even if you're getting some benefits with the oral minoxidil, they won't last forever if you don't block those androgens somehow.

Also, are you in university? Do you find all the time you spend worrying about your hair interferes with it?

I dont understand it either, i wouldn't have believed it if it didn't happen to me but here i am!! Long term in not sure, i guess im hoping that im able to maintain until something better comes out haha I was studying in college but i dropped out because of hair related anxiety..

 

[FutureSaitama]

There was a theory that in some people, when their body detects 5AR suppression it reacts by producing even MORE 5AR, thus making finasteride obsolete and making things even worse. Its called reflex reflex hyperandrogenicity.

 

[bridgeburn]

I had a very abnormally high hairline even before I lost a follicle.

From the center of around where my juvenile hairline used to be to my nasion (the point of greatest indentation at where your nose starts between your eyes) measures just under 10 cm. This is simply too big for a forehead.

It needs to be at least 2.5 cm lower to be "normal big", and I'm aiming 3-3.5 cm lower to get a nice proportion.

I almost had a transplant to try to fix it but luckily ducked out at the last second when I read about forehead reduction. Transplants at most can provide 50-60 units/cm2 which would be probably half my natural density. Plus it would have wasted thousands of my donor grafts for a shitty result.

Much better to get the reduction and then transplant a few hundred to cover the scar after if needed.

I don't regret that decision at all. I'm very happy with it so far. I just regret the fact that finasteride, dutasteride, and RU have all failed me to varying extents, because I lost 4 years of hair in the process of trying them and now I'm scrambling to find something that works mid procedure. Sucks being a "hard case".

That sucks also that you are so far along at such a young age. My sincere hope (and I also hope I'm not just being overly optimistic) for all us hard cases as I keep saying is that topical darolutamide becomes cheap fast and works as well as the numbers predict.

Honestly if it doesn't, I'm pretty fucked because I've got nothing else to try, and I can't take cypro forever. You might unfortunately end up in the same boat if finasteride/dutasteride are out of the question. I doubt RU would save you completely if you're going that fast so young, though it's worth a try. in my case RU solved ~70% of my scalp itch and definitely slowed things down.

I'm taking a pretty big load of supplements already but why not - I'll pick up some zinc and B6 too. Can't hurt. Thanks.

Aren't you worried if forehead reduction could possibly make your hairloss worse??

10cm is quite a forehead i'll admit, mine is 8cm i think but its been a while since i measured it. Yeah it sucks dealing with it at 20.. i actually started receding when i was 14 but it was slow and gradual, finasteride doubled maybe even tripled the speed to the point where the change was visually noticable every 2 months and i deteriorated from a norwood 2 to a norwood 2.5 in 9 months! Im fairly sure the oral minoxidil has halted the process for now, im even getting some regrowth too. There are a boatload of anti androgens to try, its just a matter of finding and using an effective, penetrating vehicle for them. Supplements are good, i should have been taking them long ago.

Do you think Oral minoxidil is more effective than topical?

 

[phamboy24]

Is it normal?
My hair thins out at the root... (only few hair does this)

I'm so depressed.. literally cried in my bathroom yesterday.. only 18 maaan