Revivogen + spironolactone = Natural solution to Propecia?

[HatGuy]

Has anyone tried this combination before with any success? According to this article on this very site: http://www.hairlosstalk.com/hair-loss-t ... actone.php it is a great alternative to propecia for those (like me) who want to avoid potential side effects. Using both can stop or reduce activity on both sides of the 5AR enzyme. I seem to be having some pretty good success with them since I have been on spironolactone 5% for 6 months and Revivogen for 2 weeks. I'll probably post some pictures on the Success Story forum once I get the charger for my camera (granted, I seem to be a good responder) unk:

 

[nickypoos]

Many people question the effectivness of spironolactone as very little people see the 'thickening' of the miniturazied folicules. Not only this, but some claim very serious side-effects from spironolactone, much worse then any finasteride side effect such as liver failure and cardiovascular disorders.

 

[HatGuy]

I've seen thickening in my hair and so has this guy: viewtopic.php?f=30&t=57556&st=0&sk=t&sd=a Also, where are these "claims" you speak of? I have yet to see any...

 

[MrBastard]

I've seen thickening in my hair and so has this guy: viewtopic.php?f=30&t=57556&st=0&sk=t&sd=a Also, where are these "claims" you speak of? I have yet to see any...

Copyed wrong adress? All i can see there is a 7%/9% minoxidil user.
Hes results seems a bit unreal too based on 2 months and that the hairs he appear to have grown whould not even grow on 2 months even if he started to grow hair the first sec he applyed minoxidil

And about revivogen... people say it remove more DTH than propecia, 98% vs 7x%. You who are using it, how long hair do you got atm and how long time do you use to completely dry the stuff? I am interested in revivogen myself but i heard that it take 1 hour + and that your head seems oily/greasy afterwards

 

[HatGuy]

I've seen thickening in my hair and so has this guy: viewtopic.php?f=30&t=57556&st=0&sk=t&sd=a Also, where are these "claims" you speak of? I have yet to see any...

Copyed wrong adress? All i can see there is a 7%/9% minoxidil user.
Hes results seems a bit unreal too based on 2 months and that the hairs he appear to have grown whould not even grow on 2 months even if he started to grow hair the first sec he applyed minoxidil

Nah, read all his posts

see:

I'm also on a anti-antrodgen solution but don't know what the active ingredient is, it's only called "solution B" and I apply it before going to bed.

later...

Found out, solution B is 2% spironolactone.

Yeah it sort of does huh. Maybe he's an amazing responder to his hair treatments? :dunno: I seem to be a pretty good responder myself... it must somehow be related to genetics...

And about revivogen... people say it remove more DTH than propecia, 98% vs 7x%. You who are using it, how long hair do you got atm and how long time do you use to completely dry the stuff? I am interested in revivogen myself but i heard that it take 1 hour + and that your head seems oily/greasy afterwards

I've been growing out my hair for about a month and 1/2 (haven't cut it mainly due to laziness and lack of money) now and it seems that the bald spots are starting to thicken up. It IS really oily :\ Even after the three hours they say to wait before washing it... I assume it takes 2 hours to dry like minoxidil, but I could be wrong (since you apply 2mg with this one). It fits my current schedule well so I don't really have any problems with it.

 

[JWM]

That poster's--Pieter--results are almost certainly from minoxidil and not topical spironolactone.

 

[nickypoos]

I've seen thickening in my hair and so has this guy: viewtopic.php?f=30&t=57556&st=0&sk=t&sd=a Also, where are these "claims" you speak of? I have yet to see any...

Even when spironolactone is applied topically it is detectable in the blood stream, increasing serum potassium levels, putting you at risk to stomach bleeding, and even hyperkalemia.

To be honest I can't exactly remember which forum I read about people complaining about these type of side effects, but i defiantly have heard, go dig them out yourself, they are there.

Congratulations to you if you've responded well to spironolactone. You’re a rare breed. The day I see results on spironolactone alone is when I believe it. My opinion is the effectiveness of topical spironolactone is nowhere near finasteride or dutasteride.

Dr. Lee says himself; very vaguely explains why his product is sh*t.

Q. Why haven't other doctors used topical spironolactone to treat male pattern baldness?

A. Many have with variable success, but there are inherent problems with a topical spironolactone preparation.

 

[Todd]

Of all the treatments that doesn't work, spironolactone is the one that works best :whistle:

But seriously, guys. A topical trans-dermal anti androgen does work (as is the case of RU, nizoral, and the much, much underrated eucapil), but the problem with spironolactone, if I recall correctly, is that the affinity for the androgen receptor (wich it is supposed to block) is too weak, and it's degraded too rapidly.

In the case of nizoral, the trend seems to be a slow and weak effect alone, but used along with other treatments it gives greater results. I theorize that the same could be said about spironolactone.


In any case; experiece suggests that combined regiments are better than any single treatment, e.g propecia and rogaine works better than just propecia. Maybe spironolactone and rogaine works better than just rogaine?

 

[HatGuy]

Even when spironolactone is applied topically it is detectable in the blood stream, increasing serum potassium levels, putting you at risk to stomach bleeding, and even hyperkalemia.

To be honest I can't exactly remember which forum I read about people complaining about these type of side effects, but i defiantly have heard, go dig them out yourself, they are there..

I've dug through several pages on google with the key words "spironolactone cream side effects" and I didn't come up with a single result mentioning those :whistle:

Are you sure you're not confusing it with oral spironolactone?

I've seen waay more horror stories from propecia/dutasteride.

That poster's--Pieter--results are almost certainly from minoxidil and not topical spironolactone.

How do you know this? I'm guessing it's just an assumption.

But seriously, guys. A topical trans-dermal anti androgen does work (as is the case of RU, nizoral, and the much, much underrated eucapil)

I'm really interested in RU, but I'm skeptical since I haven't seen any clinical trials on it yet.

Nobody else has any comments on Revivogen?! This is seriously interesting stuff

 

[nickypoos]

I've dug through several pages on google with the key words "spironolactone cream side effects" and I didn't come up with a single result mentioning those :whistle:

Are you sure you're not confusing it with oral spironolactone?

I've seen waay more horror stories from propecia/dutasteride.

Well i just flicked back a few pages and found this, basically any sides which occur with oral spironolactone CAN occur with topical spironolactone, whethere that chance is slim or not, therefore in my opinion is a more risky option.

Hey Hairforever, actually I was the one who said I got gyno. After one month off it is starting to resolve itself. I read somewhere that drug induced gyno often resolves itself once the drug has been stopped, so hopefully that is the what's happening and it will disappear entirely. In my case it was a combination of extremely sensitive, tingly and hard nipples with an increase in fat in the tissue as well which was beginning to give my pecs a very full, breast like appearance. Now there is no unnatural sensation under my nipples and basically they are just a little puffy but shrinking.

Like GK things for me started off fine but within a few weeks it was like the spironolactone was just overwhelming my system. Too bad as I found it very effective for my scalp almost immediately.

In my mind topicals are almost certainly absorbed to some degree. I used a ridiculously small amount of S5 and yet in a few weeks was still dealing with sysemic sides. I think that people using it are probably getting systemic absorption as well but perhaps are not as sensitive to it and so not seeing sides. I am willing to bet that a before and after (2-3 months) blood test for things like T and E2 etc would reveal a systemic effect to some degree. For most it is probably less risky than finasteride. For me clearly it wasn't.

How do you know this? I'm guessing it's just an assumption.

There is no way in two months would an androgen blocker yield any significant results. The hair cycle is atleest 8 months. Obviously any regrowth was from minioxidil and not the DHT blocking.

 

[Bryan]

Even when spironolactone is applied topically it is detectable in the blood stream, increasing serum potassium levels, putting you at risk to stomach bleeding, and even hyperkalemia.

Baloney. B-A-L-O-N-E-Y. Aside from the issue of how effective it really is as a topical antiandrogen, topical spironolactone at least is a very safe treatment; it's been used by a considerable number of people, with only very sporadic incidents of side effects (most of which I would guess are probably due just to issues of local irritation from the vehicle in which the spironolactone is applied).

There was a study a while back in which human volunteers applied topical spironolactone (I believe it was in the form of a cream) to fully HALF their entire body surface area (!), and they had no problems at all with it. Now THAT is some serious topical spironolactone usage!

 

[nickypoos]

There was a study a while back in which human volunteers applied topical spironolactone (I believe it was in the form of a cream) to fully HALF their entire body surface area (!), and they had no problems at all with it. Now THAT is some serious topical spironolactone usage!

How do you explain my above post? Gyno sides on spironolactone alone if this is the case?

And I believe I’ve read a post from yourself saying it is possible that spironolactone can make its way into your blood stream? Or have I read this from someone else?

 

[Bryan]

How do you explain my above post? Gyno sides on spironolactone alone if this is the case?

To be honest with you, I don't believe it. You have to be careful when evaluating these anecdotes you see on the Internet.

And I believe I’ve read a post from yourself saying it is possible that spironolactone can make its way into your blood stream? Or have I read this from someone else?

Must have been somebody else. I don't recall ever saying such a thing.

 

[nickypoos]

Well that’s one myth cleared up for me.

Anyway back to the effectiveness on spironolactone which was his question, how would you compare the effectiveness (in hair maintenance terms) of topical spironolactone to oral finasteride?

 

[HatGuy]

The combination of Revivogen and spironolactone Cream seems to have an effectiveness comparable to Propecia (something that has been largely ignored in this topic). In terms of maintenance, I'm not sure yet.

 

[Todd]

Well that’s one myth cleared up for me.

Anyway back to the effectiveness on spironolactone which was his question, how would you compare the effectiveness (in hair maintenance terms) of topical spironolactone to oral finasteride?

I believe finasteride is considered to be the most effective drug to date for maintaining; with something close to 80% of users experiencing a total stop (someone please correct me if I'm wrong). Topical spironolactone only have, as far as I know, anecdotal evidence; and many of those with results use a lot of other stuff in addition.

 

[Bryan]

Topical spironolactone only have, as far as I know, anecdotal evidence; and many of those with results use a lot of other stuff in addition.

No, that's not true! There's more than just anecdotal evidence for topical spironolactone for fighting male pattern baldness: there are medical journal studies which have successfully tested it for that specific condition. Most notably, there's an Italian study which did that; I scanned it quite some time ago, and made it available for people to download and read. Unfortunately, GeoCities no longer makes those scans freely available to the public, so I no longer have a link to it available for you.

 

[Boondock]

Even when spironolactone is applied topically it is detectable in the blood stream, increasing serum potassium levels, putting you at risk to stomach bleeding, and even hyperkalemia.

Baloney. B-A-L-O-N-E-Y. Aside from the issue of how effective it really is as a topical antiandrogen, topical spironolactone at least is a very safe treatment; it's been used by a considerable number of people, with only very sporadic incidents of side effects (most of which I would guess are probably due just to issues of local irritation from the vehicle in which the spironolactone is applied).

There was a study a while back in which human volunteers applied topical spironolactone (I believe it was in the form of a cream) to fully HALF their entire body surface area (!), and they had no problems at all with it. Now THAT is some serious topical spironolactone usage!

Indeed. It's worth pointing out that not only did the volunteers have no problems, but their bloods were taken following application. spironolactone was not in the blood, and appears to have been metabolized either in the skin or almost immediately in the blood.

It can't cause problems. Word.

 

[MrBastard]

http://www.hairlosstalk.com/hair-loss-treatments/revivogen/revivogen-spironolactone.php
An article from hairlosstalk.com

 

[guybrush]

Topical spironolactone only have, as far as I know, anecdotal evidence; and many of those with results use a lot of other stuff in addition.

No, that's not true! There's more than just anecdotal evidence for topical spironolactone for fighting male pattern baldness: there are medical journal studies which have successfully tested it for that specific condition. Most notably, there's an Italian study which did that; I scanned it quite some time ago, and made it available for people to download and read. Unfortunately, GeoCities no longer makes those scans freely available to the public, so I no longer have a link to it available for you.

http://img195.imageshack.us/f/spironolactone.gif/

It's the only hair loss study I've ever found on spironolactone but it has serious limitations:

1. Hair density was assessed using a conventional rating scale (0=hair almost absent, 1=hair very scanty, 2=hair rather thin, 3=hair moderately thin) and standardized photography, which is rather subjective.

2. There was no control group, so there is no way to know whether the subjective rating scale and researchers' expectations affected the results or not.

I would take it with grain of salt.