One man's opinion on DHT

[Redbone]

Duchaine invented Designer Whey protein and some other supplements like Ultimate Organge in the 90's. He pionered the work on Ephedrine and other extreme treatements. He was extensively involved in steroids and when he served time turned to reading and writing articles on steroid use andhow to get the most from them.

In the end he was discredited because he had no scientific basis to his work. He was not a medical doctor or Chemist. He was later referred to in magazines as "A little boy pretending to be a doctor." But in his time he was viewed as the absolute authority on steroids, mainly because he was the only one who had the balls to write about them and answer peoples questions. Patrick Arnold seems like another fraud to me as he owns Ergoparm a pro- hormone body building supplement company. He is not a prize winning chemist and for that matter has not even had any works published in the medical journals. So how can he give us advice on DHT and Hormones?

It seems as though his opinions are to sway people toward buying his products. One of his most succesful OXO is supposed to keep Test from Aromatizing into DHT and Estrogen.

 

[Bryan]

Bryan,

Thanks. What topicals are you using these days??

Basically Dr. Proctor's stuff, Rogaine, spironolactone, Retin-A, and occasionally some other topical concoctions like 11a-OHP, phenytoin, green tea extract, and linoleic acid.

Bryan

 

[NilesTilden]

Basically Dr. Proctor's stuff, Rogaine, spironolactone, Retin-A, and occasionally some other topical concoctions like 11a-OHP, phenytoin, green tea extract, and linoleic acid.

Bryan[/quote]

So Bry, have you had good maintanance/regrowth with these topicals, and for how long?

I'd like to quit finasteride. I did for 7 months or so earlier this year, and was just on minoxidil and Lee's 2% spironolactone. Around 6-7 months after quitting I was pretty sure I was shedding finasteride hairs from the crown, that scared me into getting back on.

 

[Hairybush1]

Duchaine invented Designer Whey protein and some other supplements like Ultimate Organge in the 90's. He pionered the work on Ephedrine and other extreme treatements. He was extensively involved in steroids and when he served time turned to reading and writing articles on steroid use andhow to get the most from them.

In the end he was discredited because he had no scientific basis to his work. He was not a medical doctor or Chemist. He was later referred to in magazines as "A little boy pretending to be a doctor." But in his time he was viewed as the absolute authority on steroids, mainly because he was the only one who had the balls to write about them and answer peoples questions. Patrick Arnold seems like another fraud to me as he owns Ergoparm a pro- hormone body building supplement company. He is not a prize winning chemist and for that matter has not even had any works published in the medical journals. So how can he give us advice on DHT and Hormones?

It seems as though his opinions are to sway people toward buying his products. One of his most succesful OXO is supposed to keep Test from Aromatizing into DHT and Estrogen.

that answers my question. I thought that maybe you had some personal contact with him in which he gave you some bad advice.

 

[Guest]

What did Duchaine die from?

And the Mentzer's????????

 

[Redbone]

I think it was liver or kidney failure. Happend a while back maybe 3 or 4 years ago.

You mean heavy duty Mike? His brother died first and he died a short while later after hearing the news.

Bruce how about super ripped Andrea's Munzer and Muhamed Benazziza?

 

[Hairybush1]

I see where you guys are trying to go BUT, how many body builders DIDNT die from taking steroids compared to those that we ASSUME died of steroid ABUSE?

Actually,I dont think you can even compare the two groups as one highly out numbers the other by a million to one.

 

[Redbone]

Actually bush many more die from taking diuretics and having no hydration in their bodies, they need to be super ripped man like arnold. Their are a great number of body builders who have had kidney dialysis and are still pumping hard, Yours truly is a three time winner.

 

[Hairybush1]

Sure, just some people do not differentiate between the two different drugs, (diuretic and a steroid), that is why I lumped them together.

Even if you did put the 2 groups together the number of people keeling over is hardly registered. The only reason that so many guys (pro bodybuilders) are getting sick now is the level of ABUSE thats going on. Proper use and abuse are to different things indeed.

Glad to hear that your still going strong despite the hurtles. Im still putting together my next cycle, where Ill be adding Growth Hormone. Cant wait.

 

[Guest]

I see where you guys are trying to go BUT, how many body builders DIDNT die from taking steroids compared to those that we ASSUME died of steroid ABUSE?

Well we cant know for sure as no credible data collection is going on here. However, given the reams of data on the impact of anabolic streroids on human health, we can INFER that these deaths are likely related to these boys doing a bit too much with the roids.

 

[Hairybush1]

I see where you guys are trying to go BUT, how many body builders DIDNT die from taking steroids compared to those that we ASSUME died of steroid ABUSE?

Well we cant know for sure as no credible data collection is going on here. However, given the reams of data on the impact of anabolic streroids on human health, we can INFER that these deaths are likely related to these boys doing a bit too much with the roids.

Wont argue with you there. Some guys just dont see any limit when it comes to the stuff, (roids). Its a shame too, as many great phyiques were transformed into blobs of mass with no shape, with all the current amount of drug use. im a fan of the older bodybuilers of the 80's and the very early 90's, wheere streoids wer estill employed but at much safer doses.

 

[Redbone]

Bush HGH is expensive man, are you rich? I like the body builders you talked about, remember Rich Gaspari and Berry Demay? How about Gary Strydom?

I once new a user who cocktailed 5 steroids at once on an ongoing basis, wonder what ever became of him? He was freakin hug though.

 

[Hairybush1]

Yeah Gh is expensive. I cant find my price list now but I'll be looking at spending at least $2500. I hear lots of conflicting repliesas to GH effectivness at gaining mass but Im a real curious person and have a hard time believing that some guys still train hard enough because they think the drugs will do all the work for them.

As far as bb'ers are concerned, the guys you mentioned all looked great. I also liked Zane, Tony Pearson, Mohammed Makaway(?), Bob Paris, Lee Haney, LeBrada. There are more but thse are the guys I remember reading about when I was 13-14 and wanted to look like.

Im not into exotic steroids and crazy cycles. I wouldnt even take testosterone because of its effect on the hair but Im losing it already anyway, what difference is it gonna make now, plus testosterone makes the other more anabolic steroids work a little better.

I hope body building goes back to the older look.

It seems this thread got hijaked.

 

[Redbone]

Dorian Yates was still one of the biggest and baddest freaks ever, his legs and back are phenomenal, better than Arnold or Ron Coleman.

You ever take Growth before?

 

[VoRteX]

I read that article quite a while back and I agree with most of it.

The primary reason I quit finasteride is because I didnt feel comfortable altering my hormones. There are just too many unknowns. I'd rather slowly go bald and fight with my topicals than do strange things to my endocrine system in the hopes that I _might_ keep my hair longer.

 

[Hairybush1]

No, cant say that I have tried GH before but I am very tempted to try it because i seem to respond very well to drugs in general.

 

[Healthy Nick]

man, I seriously hope I didn't f*** up my development by taking Propecia. I hope everything happened the way it should have.... :cry:

 

[HairyN]

HairLossTalk.com who the hell is Patrick Arnold is he a doctor? or another Dan Duchaine or Jeff Summer's???

PA is bodybuilding chemist and CEO of Ergopharm...premier producers of prohormone/hormone altering substances right now...their 1AD is especially popular

Hes relatively famous...ive seen his name in ALOT of articles in popular exercise/bodybuilding magazines


Nick if you've started taking propecia before reaching your potential i wouldnt completely rule out having messed up your development...not trying to be a pessimist just being real with you...maybe you can still get off if you havent been on for too long?

 

[Thinning]

Im making really good gains since returning to the gym this summer ( following shoulder surgery ). And Ive been taking propecia for almost a year.

Maybe the competitive steroid using athletes can notice the difference in performance that propecia saps from men but I cant.

Besides its not like he did a double blind study or anything. Id take that article with a grain of salt.

Oh and BTW the DHT is not to blame, its our overly sensitive folicles that fall out to easy! As I recall, men all have very similar DHT levels in the blood, with not enough variance to justify the large difference in hair loss. The problem is that our hairs are genetically more sensitive to DHT than non-balding men.

 

[Hairybush1]

I noticed a dip in strength at the gym when I first started Propecia but as I have already stated, that has changed for the better. Much better, in fact, so I too dont know where these guys come across as saying that we would get progressivly weaker.