Oh no, another blow for the 'natural types"

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Study Finds Herbal Treatment Ineffective
By LINDSEY TANNER

CHICAGO (AP) - Echinacea failed to relieve children's cold symptoms and appeared to cause skin rashes in some cases, a study of 407 youngsters found.

It is one of the largest studies yet to question the benefits of the popular but unproven herbal remedy.

With reported sales of more than $300 million annually, echinacea is one of the most widely used herbal remedies nationwide. Also known as the purple coneflower, echinacea is sold in a variety of over-the-counter preparations, including pills, drops and lozenges that are purported to boost the body's disease-fighting immune system.

Anecdotal reports and some animal studies suggest the herb can prevent and relieve respiratory infections, but human studies have had mixed results. The herb was not effective at treating colds in a small study of college students published last year.

In the current study of 407 Seattle-area children ages 2 to 11, echinacea plant extract worked no better than a dummy preparation in reducing sneezing, runny noses and fever.

``We did not find any group of children in whom echinacea appeared to have a positive benefit,'' said the researchers, led by Dr. James Taylor of the University of Washington's Child Health Institute.

Symptoms lasted an average of nine days in children given echinacea and in those taking the placebo, and the overall severity of symptoms were similar.

Mild skin rashes occurred in 7 percent of colds treated with echinacea but in only 2.7 percent of colds treated with the dummy preparation. None of the rashes required medical treatment.

The findings appear in Wednesday's Journal of the American Medical Association.

Healthy patients were enrolled and followed for four months. At the outset, parents were instructed to call the researchers when their children developed at least two cold symptoms. Parents then were asked to start administering treatment.

That lag time may explain why no benefits were found, said Mark Blumenthal, executive director of the American Botanical Council, an independent group that studies herbs. He said echinacea is thought to work best if taken as soon as the first symptoms appear.

Some of the children had multiple colds during the study, but there were 33 fewer colds in the echinacea group - results Blumenthal said suggest that echinacea might have helped prevent subsequent colds.

Taylor called those results could be just a fluke. The study was not designed to examine prevention.

Blumenthal said the rashes that developed may have been a rare side effect from pollen in the echinacea plant flower. The echinacea used in the study was made by the German company Madaus AG and contained extract mostly from the flower. Blumenthal said many echinacea products are made instead from the root.

Jim Bruce, president of Madaus' United States-based subsidiary, said numerous previous studies showed the product to be effective at preventing and treating colds.

On the Net:

JAMA: http://jama.ama-assn.org


12/02/03 16:24

© Copyright The Associated Press. All rights reserved. The information contained In this news report may not be published, broadcast or otherwise distributed without the prior written authority of The Associated Press.


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Redbone

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I have had much better luck with zinc based products like Zycam, especially up here in the cold northeast where the temp is 12 F right now.
 

Stingray

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It's a well known fact that a cold is a virus and incurable.

Why would herbal remedies be any different than scientifically designed synthetic remedies?
 

garthbrooks

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yah my impression was that it was just an antioxidant, and can help possibly prevent colds such as vitmain c can (strengthens your immune system i believe).
 

20something

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My Dad is an MD and my Mom practices traditional medicine. It's an interesting mix. Whenever I have health problems I always get advice from both of them.

I'm very much pro western medicine, and I generally stay away from my Mom's natural treatments, but I've seen her do wonders for people via acupuncture that have chronic conditions or pain that regular drugs, physiotherapy etc. could not help.
 
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Stingray said:
It's a well known fact that a cold is a virus and incurable.

Why would herbal remedies be any different than scientifically designed synthetic remedies?

But STING, it is NATURAL, it MUST work as this is how God intended it to be!
 

lentara

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echinachea is supposed to be an immune system booster not a cure for colds; more like a preventative. There is no cure for colds natural or otherwise.(I know b/c I'm working on my 4th bout of bronchitis this year!!!) :evil: This does not mean that all "natural" remedies are bogus. Nor does it mean that all natural remedies work either.
just my 2 cents. :)
 
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Absolutely, I agree with your post, some natural compound can be effective medicines. I posted this because we do get "natural" types here who assume that everything "natural" is harmless and effective.

So, using hemlock as an example............................ :hairy:
 

HairlossTalk

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There are a handful of "natural" products that I swear by, and the reason for it is that they have been clinically tested, extensively, and shown to work. This is not true for things like Saw Palmetto and hair loss.

One of them, as redbone mentioned, is Zicam for colds. It is a nasal gel. The stuff works so well for me that I even did an article on it a long time ago here on the site. The science (note I said SCIENCE, not THEORY as with saw palmetto for hair loss) behind it is that the zinc ions actually bind at the receptor sites for the cold virus and inhibit its replication. Simply put, you shoot the stuff up in there at the first sign of sniffling and sneezing and you actually inhibit the cold's ability to multiply itself and continue attaching itself to the receptors in your nasal and throat passages. This allows the body enough time to realize its there and kill what has already binded. For someone who has religiously had 2-3 colds a year for his entire life (me), I have not had a single full blown cold in 3 years since i started using it. Its all dependant upon how quickly you start though. You can't wait more than 24 hours after you start to sneeze or the virus will have multiplied enough to cause you at least a few days discomfort. It's a product I don't sell that I recommend EVERYONE get and use. Its in every drug store. Its expensive but the reason why is that it works.

The other "natural" treatment is Broccoli. If you're not aware of all the studies done on broccoli with everything from cancer to colon health to blood cleansing, then you should read up on it.

The last one I swear by is Acidophilus capsules (powder inside). Anytime I get uncomfortable in the intestines or can feel that things aren't going to be as .... solid... as usual .... taking one or two of those will literally cure it within the day. Don't even need to eat nasty tasting unsweetened yogurt. Just pop the tab. It introduces natural bacteria to your intestines which may be underabundant, resulting in diahrreah at the time. It restores the balance and restores your body's digestive abilities, and completely eliminates the condition.

The intelligent person will go to pubmed and search for studies on natural treatments, and, if in abundance, use them in the manner found in the study. The unintelligent person will blindly use anything natural because he or she thinks "natural" means "safer". In reality, every single natural substance has the potential to cause harm to the body. Some do, some dont. Some will kill you. Some can paralyze you. Don't buy into the baloney that pharmaceutical = bad and natural = good.

Put pharmaceuticals and herbs/natural treatments on the same level. Require that BOTH are subjected to the same scrutiny for EFFECTIVENESS and SAFETY. Neither are exempt from this.

HairLossTalk.com
 

wheresmyhair

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I am still for natural over chemicals....and echinacea is an immune booster not a direct cure...

I would like to inform everyone I have given Saw Palmetto the flick, as lately I ve been having some problems with it and my hair, so I am going wait and see how respond without it useage...and contemplating fluridil if I can get it....

so no more wars on SAW..
cheers
 
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wheresmyhair said:
I am still for natural over chemicals....and echinacea is an immune booster not a direct cure...

I would like to inform everyone I have given Saw Palmetto the flick, as lately I ve been having some problems with it and my hair, so I am going wait and see how respond without it useage...and contemplating fluridil if I can get it....

so no more wars on SAW..
cheers

I think the study suggests that ech does not boost the immune system, at least enough to shorten a cold duration.
 

Stingray

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So you won't try propecia, but you will try an anti-androgen 40 times more powerful that was still designed in a test tube?

The wonders of logic defy me still today.
 

Mr T.

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Stingray said:
So you won't try propecia, but you will try an anti-androgen 40 times more powerful that was still designed in a test tube?

The wonders of logic defy me still today.

You're talking about saw palmetto? Designed in a test tube? 40 times more powerful? Please clarify.

Saw palmetto might not be better than finasteride when it comes to hairloss, but it has been shown - in a Merck study to boot - that saw palmetto has more of a beneficial effect on the urinary tract than Proscar. So for men taking finasteride for prostate problems, you're probably better off with saw palmetto. Some doctors have theorized this is because saw palmetto has an estrogen-lowering effect, whereas finasteride does not. There are some studies that strongly indicate that estrogen has a very bad effect on the prostate.

I agree with what HairLossTalk.com says. Natural remedies and pharmaceuticals should be subjected to the same level of scrutiny. In some cases, one is better than the other, and in other cases, vice versa.

Cheers.

Jeremy
 

Stingray

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Sorry Mr. T. Kinda went reply happy and forgot that there was a page 2. I was referring to the guy just before brucey posted.. about fluridil. Saw palmetto can be more potent than finasteride too though. Just in different ways. I think it's my saving grace actually.
 

Mr T.

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Well, I suppose he's more comfortable with using a topical anti-androgen, under the assumption that topicals are safer than internals - which is something I agree with.

However, even with topicals, you run the risk of occasional systemic absorption. That's what happened to a bloke by the name of Richlocks over at HLH. He was using RU, but had to stop due to apparent systemic absorption.

So it goes, as Vonnegut says in Slaughterhouse Five.

Cheers.

Jeremy
 

Stingray

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All topicals are slightly absorbed systemically. Fluridil is some strong sh*t too. I can almost guarantee that if you have side effects with propecia, then you will have side effects with topical fluridil.
 
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