I'm so done with all these health supplements...

CCS

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Not all of them, but most:

The unscrupulous sales people keep saying, "a study says it makes significant improvements.". Well they know full well that the word significant has more than one meaning. In the contest of every abstract you read, it means statistically significant. The actual difference could be 0.5%, but as long as one group actually had an improvement that is not just a random fluke, they may use the word "significant", and shorten the phrase by dropping the word "statistically".


Many of the sites that sell this stuff will not provide links to the studies. Even the company selling it, which paid for the study, will not disclose the full study, so you don't know what was actually done.


For example, they say some carotenoid protects you from sunburn. I'd like to see if they used beta carotene as the control or not. Why would I buy the product if plain old beta carotene can do the same thing? And does the carotenoid actually protect against sunburned DNA, or does it just reduce and prevent inflammation so you don't know you are being damaged? You'll find out in 20 years. But it is only spf 2 - 7.


That or they study the effects of high doses of a vitamin. What they don't say in the abstract is that both the control and the test group are highly deficient in the vitamin, so of course the mega dose group does better. If I'm going to buy something, I want to know how it affects healthy people like me.

Or the resveratrol sellers, failing to ever mention that the liver metabolizes almost all the resveratrol before it ever reaches your blood, and that the remaining levels are 1% the concentration found effective in their studies.


Or doctor mercola selling krill oil because it has a carotenoid in it (which is 1/1000 the dose needed to reduce sunburns), and he says krill oil is not rancid like fish oi (but fish oil has vitamin E added which keeps it from going rancid. Just bit one open and see.)


I'll stick to the vitamines C and E for now. 200mg of C, and 100 mg of a mixture of natural E isomers. And borageseed oil and fish oil. The liver does not destroy those.


And some studies say, "maybe resveratrol metabolites work". OK, then make them and test them in vitro. Why hasn't anyone ever tested the metabolites in vitro?

And there is Hyarulonic acid, way to big to be absorbed by the skin or the gut, yet sold in creams and pills. The Okanowans synthesize it because they are youthful. They don't get it from their diet. They are 5 years more youthful than us because they don't over eat. And they are not as hungry because they eat fiber.

Then there is a study saying if you take 750 miligrams of properly processed cat claw extract, it protects your DNA. Only problem is the company that sells it sells it in doses of 3 drops per day, for $30 a month. They need to read their own study and see that is not enough to do anything.
 

CCS

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As for the cron diet, we learned that if you overeat your whole life, you die sooner. The controls were not given a normal diet equivalent to an FDA approved 2000 calories. They were allowed to eat as much as they wanted, which I believe invalidates the study. The abstracts also fail to mention if the controls were given the same high nutrition density as the test group.

I found one study where the test group was given 1/3 the calorie intake as the control group, and lived almost 2x as long. It was in mice.

As for the monkey test, the 12 monkeys that did not gorge themselves lived 33% longer than the fat ones, but the oldest monkey by far was one monkey in the eat at will group. Who knows how much she ate. The study did not say what the controls ate. They just were allowed to eat what they want, which could have been any amount. No data recorded means 40 years of tax dollars wasted to prove fat people die a bit sooner than moderate eaters.


I swear it seems like the scientists running these experiments are so incompetent that maybe they are deliberately messing it up to get published with something new.
 

GeminiX

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Health supplements and alternative treatments are almost all utter nonsense.

They have either been proven to not work or have not been proven to work.

Treatments which have been proven to work are called medicine :)
 

Nashville Hairline

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:bravo:

I used to read Mercola's site but as time has gone on he's stopped hiding the fact he just wants to sell you his supplements. It leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

I think s.a.f. or someone posted a YouTube movie about the steroid industry and showed how easy it is in the US to sell your own supplements..roughly all you need do is buy the powdered vitamin, a bulking agent and slap on the sticker that features the disclaimer quoted in my signature and you are ready to go.

The morals of the natural supp industry are as questionable as those in big pharma.
 

GeminiX

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Nashville Hairline said:
:bravo:

I used to read Mercola's site but as time has gone on he's stopped hiding the fact he just wants to sell you his supplements. It leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

I think s.a.f. or someone posted a YouTube movie about the steroid industry and showed how easy it is in the US to sell your own supplements..roughly all you need do is buy the powdered vitamin, a bulking agent and slap on the sticker that features the disclaimer quoted in my signature and you are ready to go.

The morals of the natural supp industry are as questionable as those in big pharma.

I would say their moral standing is *far* worse; they can claim anything, have to do no testing and are not susceptible to litigation.

Alternative therapy and "natural" medicine is a complete scam which preys on the naive and desperate.
 

person

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I reckon CCS is right to be taking the vit C and E though; I myself take green tea capsules which I believe have numerous benefits; amino acids and a general all around multi vitamin. I don't think this is too overboard; some members on this forum take more pills than one could possibly imagine.
 

CCS

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You get all the amino acids you need in food with protein. The protein you eat is turned into amino acids before you absorb it.

Green tea extract is a cheap way to get lots of it, though I would not take a lot. Too much can be bad, I think. Just take as much as you can dissolve in the water you drink.

My main fear with green tea is some sources have tons of fluoride in them. I eat cocoa powder instead. It has many of the same benefits as green tea and pomegranates, but much cheaper and less quality issues, and no shipping.

I try to get 200mg of vitamin C daily from kiwi, though I guess a pill is good too. I think you should supplement with 500 micro grams of vitamin K2, and 3000 IU of vitamin D3, 4000 if you avoid the sun like you should. The k1 in spinach is not the right kind. You want the stuff made in your gut. Spinach is good for your eyes though.

Your body only stores alpha tocopherol. It takes the other ones, but uses them quick. I would be sure to get the alpha, though not exclusively. I would not worry about how much of the others are in there, as long as they are in there and in their natural form. The tocotrienols might do something though, but maybe are good topically.

I think the key's to health are to get enough fiber in everything you consume so that you don't have spikes, and to reduce how much food you eat so you can get some cron diet benefits or at least not the opposite. That and get plenty of the nutrients so you are not mall nourished. I think taking antioxidants are more important as you get older, when your body can't make enough of what it needs. When one thing fails, it causes other stuff to fail, in a cascade.

8 hours of sleep is another health key. You need to feel rested in the morning.
 

squeegee

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GeminiX said:
Health supplements and alternative treatments are almost all utter nonsense.

They have either been proven to not work or have not been proven to work.

Treatments which have been proven to work are called medicine :)

Got get yourself medicine and I would take my supplements! Have a big background in bodybuilding and being myself in the Military I get Blood work done regularly and having any kind of tests being Aircrew crew right now.. and yes Supplements make a big difference in my health. Taking the right supplements, having a balance diet with real food and hittin the gym regularly will cut the difference.. Medicine is a last resort option.
 

CCS

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squeegee said:
Medicine is a last resort option.

Unless it is finasteride.
 
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