I Think This Is Sheseido's Phase Ii Trial! Should Start Soon

Beowulf

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jc3303

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Well looks promising, but then I've got no idea about release date.

Gotta love how the World Congress for Hair Research is entirely Japanese.

Release date will be 2018 if this proves to be safe and effective. I doubt it will be a full roll out in Japan in 2018, but they will be offering it.
 

Beowulf

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Release date will be 2018 if this proves to be safe and effective. I doubt it will be a full roll out in Japan in 2018, but they will be offering it.
That's what they've said, but I'm not so certain.

Phase I is done and dusted and we know that the treatment is safe, so why aren't they offering treatment now that Phase II (or maybe III) is underway?

Unless they don't trust Replicel, which I wouldn't blame them for.
 

jc3303

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They're trying different doses in this trial I think so they may not yet know what the most effective dose is yet. Also the 2nd trial just started I imagine they need some numbers from it before they can start to offer treatment and also proof that the different doses are safe.
 

That Guy

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Phase 1 trials are primarily about safety.

Phase 2 is about safety and efficacy.

Generally you want a good mix of the two before offering the treatment.
 

Beowulf

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Phase 1 trials are primarily about safety.

Phase 2 is about safety and efficacy.

Generally you want a good mix of the two before offering the treatment.

Doesn't the FDA usually require a Phase III trial as well? I always thought you needed all three, but with all this IIa crap going around I'm not even sure any more.
 

That Guy

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Doesn't the FDA usually require a Phase III trial as well? I always thought you needed all three, but with all this IIa crap going around I'm not even sure any more.

The FDA has no influence in Japan.

Their phases are intentionally drawn out because sponsors. Taken from their website:

Phase 1 studies are usually conducted in healthy volunteers. The goal here is to determine what the drug's most frequent side effects are and, often, how the drug is metabolized and excreted. The number of subjects typically ranges from 20 to 80.

Phase 2 studies begin if Phase 1 studies don't reveal unacceptable toxicity. While the emphasis in Phase 1 is on safety, the emphasis in Phase 2 is on effectiveness. This phase aims to obtain preliminary data on whether the drug works in people who have a certain disease or condition. For controlled trials, patients receiving the drug are compared with similar patients receiving a different treatment--usually an inactive substance (placebo), or a different drug. Safety continues to be evaluated, and short-term side effects are studied. Typically, the number of subjects in Phase 2 studies ranges from a few dozen to about 300.

At the end of Phase 2, the FDA and sponsors try to come to an agreement on how large-scale studies in Phase 3 should be done. How often the FDA meets with a sponsor varies, but this is one of two most common meeting points prior to submission of a new drug application. The other most common time is pre-NDA--right before a new drug application is submitted.

Phase 3 studies begin if evidence of effectiveness is shown in Phase 2. These studies gather more information about safety and effectiveness, studying different populations and different dosages and using the drug in combination with other drugs. The number of subjects usually ranges from several hundred to about 3,000 people.
 

Beowulf

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The FDA has no influence in Japan.
Fair enough, I just figured it was a world-wide industry norm.

I'm surprised my country doesn't just take the FDA's word for it and not both investigating FDA approved treatments.
 

NormanNorwood

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This might be a stupid question but where does Replicel come into this now? There product is the injection which makes your hair permanently resistant to DHT and possibly grow back right?

Tsuji is for the high Norwood's who want a full hair restoration and then Replicel is for people who are a lower Norwood and just want to keep what they have right?

I only ask cause no matter how good Tsuji is I will never get my god tier hair density back with a transplant. I want injections to rejuvenate the follicles again.. I know those cute little bastards are in there still..
 

Hero

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How likely would it be if they test it only on the vertex with good results that patients would be able to get the treatment on their hairline? Would it be possible they won't do it since it's only been proven to work on the vertex? Also, anyone know how easy (or difficult) it would be for a foreigner to get a procedure such as this in Japan?
 

Beowulf

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There product is the injection which makes your hair permanently resistant to DHT and possibly grow back right?

So far it's been proven to increase hair density and increase hair count. From what I can tell there isn't really any proof that it make your hair immune to DHT. It's more that they need to take it from the permanent zone, instead of just any part of your scalp, and from what we can tell no one lost any more hair due to DHT. So that sort of suggests that the treatment did manage to migrate the permanency factor to the vulnerable hairs. As far I know only Replicel know what a dermal sheath cup cell is, since I've never seen a study that mentions them, and these cells cause irregular, thick hair growth in mice.

I've always thought that theory was just that since we can replicate the dermal papilla cells, we could just replace the one's that are lost. My fear is that none of these treatments are really rectifying the pathological processes and are merely copying Minoxidil by increasing the growth period of already growing hairs temporarily.

Does anyone have any evidence that suggests that if a hair follicle is not long enough to leave the skin, it will not grow at all?
 

Grasshüpfer

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Sorry for the off-topic but wow, jeez man, where did you read about this??!! I googled and did not find anything!

“In a worst case scenario wherein Shiseido is able to show breach of contract by RepliCel, we may lose some or all rights to milestone and royalty payments from Shiseido but still be in a position to capitalize on the product’s enormous potential everywhere else in the world. In the meantime, we remain steadfast to our position that the mutual obligations in the agreement remain intact,” Buckler concluded.

http://replicel.com/replicel-provides-update-shiseido-license-co-development-rch-01/
 
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