How true are the reports of hair loss worsened by Propecia?

[azmodien]

How does one know if they are one of the few who are having a bad reaction to Propecia?

I have been taking it for two months and I am debating on whether or not I should quit. I have been battling side effects and accelerated hair loss and I am apprehensive about making my situation worse by continuing with the treatment. I want to have faith in the positive reports but it is disconcerting when I read statements like "Propecia ruined my hairline!" from people who seem to have had my exact experience early on with this drug.

I think my body might not be adjusting the medication since I have developed acne for the first time in my life. My scalp is crazy itchy and I think that the hair loss I have been experiencing is more serious than the normal shedding described by others. I don't think I have reflex hyperandrogenicity though, since my libido still isn't 100% and morning erections are non-existent.

Have any of these negative posters stuck with their regimen and later recanted their statements? Propecia can't possibly cause permanent hair loss, can it?

Here is an example of such reports:

http://www.hairlosshelp.com/forums/mess ... TMP=Linear

Thanks.

(note, I am 24 and currently on 0.75 mg of name brand Propecia. I have been tweaking the dosage to find a balance between baldness and impotence. I am going to try and stay on a consistent dose from this point on.)

 

[azmodien]

Does no one have an opinion on this? I thought it would be a controvesial topic.

 

[Cassin]

Most people don't grasp that propecia can take a year to work as clearly stated in the literature so they panic and hop off of it when its simply their normal hair loss progressing.

I will never understand why people self medicate a drug that they don't do any research on aside from what they read on a internet forum.

 

[azmodien]

I thouroughly read the literature and understand the time frame for results. I was only commenting on the reports from certain posters who have claimed that they had accellerated hair loss through 1+ year of treatment when they had only started with mild thinning.

I have also read a lot of conflicting information regarding hormonal changes when starting Propecia and a possibility of permanent hair loss as a result. I just wanted to know if anyone else has investigated these claims at all.

 

[Cassin]

Nowhere do you mention seeing a doctor and you aren't even using the proper dose.

After 2 months you're considering quitting?

 

[azmodien]

I have seen a few doctors and none of them are very imformed on the drug. My dermatologist isn't aware of any shedding reported by Propecia users. As far as the dose goes, I have heard from many sources that DHT responds the same to any amount of finasteride from 0.2 mg to 5 mg. For some reason, cutting the dose seems to lessen the sides though. 1mg completely wrecks my libido so I scaled it back a bit to an acceptable compromise.

The reason I am considering quitting is based on:

1.) acne (not a common reported side effect, and suggests a hormone issue)
2.) sexual sides
3.) heavy shedding

I can live with the first two and I can deal with the shedding if I am sure that it is only temporary. I was doing fine until I read the posts about users who never stopped shedding, even after a year. It is nagging on my mind, and I had to look into it before I decided to continue taking the medication.

 

[Cassin]

very well said and now I clearly see where you stand.

however...most people don't do a fraction of the research you have obviously done. So consider that when you read posts.

 

[azmodien]

most people don't do a fraction of the research you have obviously done. So consider that when you read posts.

I wish I didn't have to scour the internet for weeks to find out the true effects of this drug, but the information seems to very sketchy. No one seems to know anything for sure, so I can't dismiss anything I read without checking it out.

When I read the propeciahelp forums, I can file most of those people under "alarmist hypochondriacs", but a few of the stories on this forum about bad experiences ring true to my own early experience, so I get freaked out. If Merck said "You will go bald temporarily for 6 months and then regrow your hair better than before" I would be anxiety free, since the side effect is expected and there is a light at the end of the tunnel. It is not knowing if I am damaging my health/hair that is bothersome. I don't want to become another bitter, pissed off poster at PropeciaHelp, cursing myself and wishing I had never taken this stuff to begin with.

 

[pproctor]

1) Early shedding (in the first 2-3 months) is either coincidental or due to follicles coming out of dormancy and shedding loss-phase hair a little early. This is benign-- the hair was about to fall out anyway and generally grows back. Because it is a sign that treatment is working, early shedding is often associated with a good eventual clinical response.

2) Continued shedding after the first 2-4 months may be just a continuation of the above.

3) Rarely, the reflex hyperandrogenicity caused by finasteride may overshoot and cause paradoxical hyperandrogenic side-effects. It is unknown whether these include exacerbation of the balding process. But this seems possible.

4) Finasteride "protects" the follicles relative to say causing acne or increased libido. So, it seems reasonable that exacerbation of the balding process would not generally happen in the absence of such other hyperandrogenic symptoms.

Peter H. Proctor, PhD,MD

 

[azmodien]

4) Finasteride "protects" the follicles relative to say causing acne or increased libido. So, it seems reasonable that exacerbation of the balding process would not generally happen in the absence of such other hyperandrogenic symptoms.

Sorry, could you elaborate on this one? I am a little unclear on the bottom line.

Thanks for your input.

 

[pproctor]

4) Finasteride "protects" the follicles relative to say causing acne or increased libido. So, it seems reasonable that exacerbation of the balding process would not generally happen in the absence of such other hyperandrogenic symptoms.

Sorry, could you elaborate on this one? I am a little unclear on the bottom line.

Thanks for your input.

Finasteride blocks type-2 5AR from making DHT from testosterone. This is important in two tissues, hair follicles and the prostate.

That is, the reflex increase in testosterone, etc. likely affects (say) oil glands (involved in acne) more that it does hair follicles, which are "protected" by finasteride.

So, we can reasonably postulate that if finasteride-induced reflex hyperandrogenicity is not causing (say) acne, it is probably not making baldness worse. True, there is no way to say for sure.

Peter H. Proctor, PhD,MD

 

[azmodien]

So, the acne could be an indicator that I am experiencing a hyperandrogenic reaction? That would be strange since my libido and erections are still only so-so.

If I stopped treatment in the future, would the hair that was lost due to testosterone probably grow back? Since the hair that was shed looked healthy, is it reasonable to assume that it would eventually return when testosterone levels return to normal? (since the follicles would no longer be under attack.)

Thanks.

 

[Real_Hair]

Most people don't grasp that propecia can take a year to work as clearly stated in the literature so they panic and hop off of it when its simply their normal hair loss progressing.

I will never understand why people self medicate a drug that they don't do any research on aside from what they read on a internet forum.

Im highly surprised that your a moderator.

Sorry.. but I am.

Reason I say that is because SURELY even you know about hyperandrogenicity?

I knew about it through my body building workouts.

There are a SHITLOAD of ppl I know who used Propecia for 4,6 and even 12 months and their hair loss accelerated.

And as a specialist once put it on BB forum.. Propecia could possibly make your receptors MORE sensitive hence make your hair loss accelerated

 

[SuperMeh]

I think as pproctor was suggesting, just because you suffer from a degree of hyperanrogenicity the fact you're still using a 5ar inhibitor means that although you may gain other symptoms of raised testosterone levels like oily skin or the like.. your hair loss should still be improved due to the lessened amount of DHT. Everyones bodies will react to the lowered DHT by increased T levels as the body compensates.

Also what should be taken into consideration is some people shed in reaction to finasteride but still see a positive results, reading through some of the success stories on this forum I see people talking about sheds throughout their entire treatment and no improvement until 12 months plus(and still sheds after this but with overall positive results), so the situation could be perceived as getting worse due to sheds AND the normal onset of AA.. while in the long term the situation will get better.

I don't think Cassin ignored this, he just said to give it time.. which indeed not enough people do, I'm on 8 months now and it was getting worse for 5 months of that.. and now thinning spots are pretty much gone.

Also, how would finasteride cause receptors to become more sensitive? Whats the mechanism behind that? I've not heard of this theory before.

Thanks

Michael

 

[Bryan]

There are a SHITLOAD of ppl I know who used Propecia for 4,6 and even 12 months and their hair loss accelerated.

Sorry, but I just can't believe that claim. I'd have to see some serious medical documentation for such an alleged effect, before I could believe it.

And as a specialist once put it on BB forum.. Propecia could possibly make your receptors MORE sensitive hence make your hair loss accelerated

I don't doubt the possibility that finasteride could make your receptors more sensitive (note that even Sawaya claimed to see an INCREASE in the number of androgen receptors in the hair follicles of men who had been using finasteride for six months), but that doesn't prove that hair loss could be accelerated by Propecia.

 

[Bryan]

Also, how would finasteride cause receptors to become more sensitive? Whats the mechanism behind that? I've not heard of this theory before.

Our bodies and the cells that comprise it have feedback mechanisms in place that try to maintain a certain level of androgenic stimulation. The sensitivity of androgen receptors may well be one of the ways the cell regulates such things, if they sense a decline in that androgenic stimulation.

 

[Cassin]

Most people don't grasp that propecia can take a year to work as clearly stated in the literature so they panic and hop off of it when its simply their normal hair loss progressing.

I will never understand why people self medicate a drug that they don't do any research on aside from what they read on a internet forum.

Im highly surprised that your a moderator.

Sorry.. but I am.

Reason I say that is because SURELY even you know about hyperandrogenicity?

I knew about it through my body building workouts.

There are a SHITLOAD of ppl I know who used Propecia for 4,6 and even 12 months and their hair loss accelerated.

And as a specialist once put it on BB forum.. Propecia could possibly make your receptors MORE sensitive hence make your hair loss accelerated

Did you read my post? I think you're wanting to argue a point I am not really making.

 

[Cassin]

I don't think Cassin ignored this, he just said to give it time.. which indeed not enough people do, I'm on 8 months now and it was getting worse for 5 months of that.. and now thinning spots are pretty much gone.

Thank you for taking the time to read my post instead of just trying to create an argument.

 

[Kaze]

Azmodien,

My post will be very helpful. I have been on propecia for 8 months now. I experienced a alot of itching, irritation, and noticed shedding withing the first two weeks. As I have thinned all over on propecia over the 8 months the itching shedding has lessoned as I have less hair on my head now. The shedding has been different from the hairloss I experienced before propecia. I had receding temples before propecia. As I started I experienced itching/thinning all over including the sides and back.

Check out irish prides my story post. It is at the top of the mystory section. He has great pictures of how his hair has changed from before he took propecia to 5 months in and then to 1.5 months off. Today he is starting it again at .5.

Anyways analyzing these photos should surly help you decide what to do now.

Currently I am debating try adovart, trying propecia at a reduced rate at .25, or just using lasercomb, rogaine and nizoral. I am also trying to get blood tests before I drop my current 1 mg propecia regiment.

Check out irishpride's story. Check page 15 for his on propecia/ off propecia pictures. He has pics scattered throughout.

 

[azmodien]

This is very confusing. There seems to be polar opposite schools of thought about this issue.

My fear about Propecia worsening hairloss is not backed up by any hard science, only anecdotal reports from a handful of people on a forum. That makes it tough to justify stopping the drug. There seems to be much more positive feedback from people who had good results after shedding. However the itching doesn't seem to be a widely reported side effect, so that concerns me. The only people who mention the itching are those who have had a bad experience. I am not shedding at the sides or back though, so I think I can eliminate Telogen Effluvium as a cause.

My question to Kaze and Irishpride or others, did you have ANY regrowth at all while on Propecia? Like little hairs along your hairline or something?