How significant is excessive sebum in relation to hair loss?

[ripple-effect]

Well I've been doing some quick searches on google and finding some pretty good information on the connection between sebum and hair loss. I did not realize how important excessive sebum would be in relation to hair loss 'till now. I just want to see people's thoughts on here while I continue my search on google.

-rp

 

[bubka]

oh geez

 

[cal]

From what I understand, sebum & hair loss show up together but one does not really cause the other. They're both caused by DHT in the skin and most hair loss sufferers have more scalp DHT than average.

Washing away the sebum on a regular basis is better than leaving it on there (to hold even more DHT in the area), but washing won't actually impede male pattern baldness in the big picture.

 

[ripple-effect]

Yes, but does shampooing even get rid of all of the sebum because I read that Jojoba oil is able to get rid of years worth of build up infering that shampoo doesn't get rid of everything. That's why I'm just realizing the connection now because when I heard that shampooing gets rid of sebum that completely eliminated the connection between hair loss and sebum from my view. I started applying jojoba oil and my hair is responding pretty well to it which is starting to make me realize or at least ponder the question.

 

[abcdefg]

You cant stop hairloss by washing your hair with anything. washing away sebum like he says wont stop hairloss. You have to stop dht to have any real effect on hairloss and dht causes hairloss and maybe sebum but the root cause is dht. How to stop dht is a problem no one has really found a good solution too. I mean yes propecia everyone will say but we see from the sides propecia can cause that its not a perfect solution to stopping production of dht if such a perfect solution exists as anything but a topical.

 

[ripple-effect]

If you were responding to me then I don't think you really read or understood my previous statement.

 

[docj077]

STOP

:jackit:

and start

All your sebum problems will disappear.

 

[closertoheaven]

I've read that DHT can sit inside of sebum and so it's bad for it to sit on your head. Of course I have no source for that so just take it for what you will.

 

[Bryan]

Well I've been doing some quick searches on google and finding some pretty good information on the connection between sebum and hair loss. I did not realize how important excessive sebum would be in relation to hair loss 'till now.

I doubt that there's any real connection. It's probably just an association, not an actual causative relationship in either direction.

 

[Bryan]

Yes, but does shampooing even get rid of all of the sebum because I read that Jojoba oil is able to get rid of years worth of build up infering that shampoo doesn't get rid of everything.

The word is IMPLYING, not inferring.

But anyway, where did you read that about jojoba oil? See my recent post over on HLH where I show with a Sebutape experiment that just an ordinary shampoo does a very good job of removing sebum from the skin/scalp.

 

[evildude]

Well I've been doing some quick searches on google and finding some pretty good information on the connection between sebum and hair loss. I did not realize how important excessive sebum would be in relation to hair loss 'till now.

I doubt that there's any real connection. It's probably just an association, not an actual causative relationship in either direction.

would you say that increased sebum production is a sign of increased dht levels within the follicle as well? so that, in short, increased sebum is a sign of increased balding? or are the two more loosely related, in the sense it can imply it, but nothing is certain?

 

[Bryan]

would you say that increased sebum production is a sign of increased dht levels within the follicle as well? so that, in short, increased sebum is a sign of increased balding?

Yeah, I suppose both of those are possible, but all of this stuff is rather speculative.

or are the two more loosely related, in the sense it can imply it, but nothing is certain?

Yes, I like it better when you put it that way!

I want to mention here a study done by Kligman many years ago: he gave androgen in the form of methyl testosterone (I believe the main dose he used was 100 mg/day, but some of the men got as much as 300 mg/day) to healthy young men and women, and then measured the effect on their sebum production. Surprisingly, there was NO EFFECT on sebum production in the young men, even at the higher dose. The effect in the women was somewhat variable, with some of them getting a little extra sebum, and some of them having no change.

There are at least a couple of possible explanations for such an odd result, and Kligman's own tentative theory at the time was that the sebum production in healthy young men is already MAXED-OUT by their own endogenous levels of androgens, so giving them extra androgen has no measurable extra effect. The sebum production in young women is NEARLY maxed-out (according to Kligman's tentative theory), so their results can vary somewhat from woman to woman.

If Kligman's theory is correct, it would seem to cast some doubt on this whole idea that excessive sebum is an indication that there's too much DHT (or any other androgen, for that matter) being produced by an individual. Maybe an individual who makes a lot of sebum is just a "sebaceous athlete", to use a term coined by Kligman in another study of his, and it doesn't really have anything to do with an unusual androgen production. It might be other genetic factors that are causing it.

 

[cal]

I read up on the basics of the sebum/washing issue a while back, and I came away thinking it's basically the same situation as diet & exercise: Being particularly good in these areas won't help male pattern baldness, but being very bad can aggravate it a little more.

 

[blaze]

I want to mention here a study done by Kligman many years ago: he gave androgen in the form of methyl testosterone (I believe the main dose he used was 100 mg/day, but some of the men got as much as 300 mg/day) to healthy young men and women, and then measured the effect on their sebum production. Surprisingly, there was NO EFFECT on sebum production in the young men, even at the higher dose. The effect in the women was somewhat variable, with some of them getting a little extra sebum, and some of them having no change.
There are at least a couple of possible explanations for such an odd result, and Kligman's own tentative theory at the time was that the sebum production in healthy young men is already MAXED-OUT by their own endogenous levels of androgens, so giving them extra androgen has no measurable extra effect. The sebum production in young women is NEARLY maxed-out (according to Kligman's tentative theory), so their results can vary somewhat from woman to woman.
If Kligman's theory is correct, it would seem to cast some doubt on this whole idea that excessive sebum is an indication that there's too much DHT (or any other androgen, for that matter) being produced by an individual. Maybe an individual who makes a lot of sebum is just a "sebaceous athlete", to use a term coined by Kligman in another study of his, and it doesn't really have anything to do with an unusual androgen production. It might be other genetic factors that are causing it.

Bryan, Maybe those tested didnt have androgen receptors that were sensitive to Androgens... well as sensitive as those who have excessive sebum production.

 

[Bryan]

Bryan, Maybe those tested didnt have androgen receptors that were sensitive to Androgens... well as sensitive as those who have excessive sebum production.

Well, the main point here isn't the absolute level of sebum in the test-subjects, it's that there was no CHANGE in their sebum levels with extra androgen.

 

[Guest]

I have high semen levels, yes. I think it helps a lot with hair loss.