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Also, holy sh*t, how has this not been implemented yet?
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/9588863/?i=6&from=/11399544/related
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/9588863/?i=6&from=/11399544/related
How Does Hair Absorb Topical Drugs?
- Thread starter Gone
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Jesus f*****g Christ, load it with a shRNA to knock out androgen receptors and you've basically got the cure right there.
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This was from the 90s... knowing how complicated but usually consistent biological terminology is, "follicle" is probably distinct from dermal papilla. I wonder if follicular absorption would affect the dermal papilla in any way. It said "negligible" amounts were found in the bloodstream, so even this wasn't perfect, but it does show that nanotechnology could be promising.
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If negligible amounts were in the bloodstream you'll probably find some made it into the skin. I think the researcher is a bit confused, I mean sure you could just it to dye hair, but there's little point in changing the genes in the follicles since they'll just fall out.
It's probably not even that bad if some gets into the blood stream. All I know is that if an shRNA gets into the genes responsible for hair growth it can protect them from androgens and save us all. I don't know how long it will last. Even if the shRNA gets into our blood stream it would only block a few AR's in the prostate, so the side effect wouldn't even be that bad.
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I was thinking about this study in the sense that it could be used for antiandrogens like CB. If you look up "dermal papilla targeting" you honestly won't find much other than a few speculative articles saying "well, this is what we'd like to do, but that's down the road."
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the shRNA would stop the AR gene entirely, after prolonged use you wouldn't have androgen receptors at all. Only question is how long will the shRNA hang around. InBeforeTheCure seemed to imply that it had more to do with the delivery method. If we used CRISPR however you could definitely destroy the AR gene which would permanently stop baldness.
You could just do a one time dose (possibly a few more) with liposome carrying cas9 and you're done. it would be super cheap as well.
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shRNA can do that? Daaaaaaamn. Yeah and in addition to how long it stays around, you need to make sure it stays exclusively in the scalp. Or you can watch your facial hair disappear.
By the time CRISPR has the capability to destroy/limit androgen receptors we will have probably lost a substantial amount of hair, which will by then require a regrowth cure. Maybe CRISPR could do this too by then.
By the time CRISPR has the capability to destroy/limit androgen receptors we will have probably lost a substantial amount of hair, which will by then require a regrowth cure. Maybe CRISPR could do this too by then.
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Yeah shRNA stops the RNA communications of the gene. And yeah facial hair is great, but I'd trade it for a thicker head of hair. Plus I'm sort of wonder if androgens simply cause vellus hair on the face go terminal and then keep growing, or whether you need prolonged androgen use. Do transsexuals still grow facial hair after androgen blockers?
The thing I'm more worried about with AR genes is that they're also in the prostate and more importantly in the brain, you need to make sure your delivery method cannot cross the blood brain barrier, otherwise it could potentially cause memory problems. That's probably why some people get brain fog.
By the time CRISPR gets into the game we'll probably have Samumed on the scene, which may have the potential to regrow all your hair and Tsuji's stem cells.
The good news is CRISPR is getting it's first clinical uses in humans next year. One's for a genetic form of blindness, but I'm not sure whether they are actually changing the blindness gene or not.
The thing I'm more worried about with AR genes is that they're also in the prostate and more importantly in the brain, you need to make sure your delivery method cannot cross the blood brain barrier, otherwise it could potentially cause memory problems. That's probably why some people get brain fog.
By the time CRISPR gets into the game we'll probably have Samumed on the scene, which may have the potential to regrow all your hair and Tsuji's stem cells.
The good news is CRISPR is getting it's first clinical uses in humans next year. One's for a genetic form of blindness, but I'm not sure whether they are actually changing the blindness gene or not.
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Interesting idea about DHT and beard growth. I know I've read on here that finasteride users aren't noticing beard thinning, even after the ~70% systemic dht reduction that we know finasteride causes. So you could be on to something... I know I'm interested in finding the answer to that concern.
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There are 3 types of AR in humans
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27807533
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27807533
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Interesting. Getting back on topic, I have a question for you Armando, or whoever knows about this stuff. You said that if you didn't use iontophoresis or an electrical current with two pads, you would need to be grounded somehow. What would this look like, you hold onto a metal pole? what would happen if you didn't ground yourself but used one pad, what would happen? What kind of trajectory would the drug take it you used iontophoresis on the ends on your hair (like in the drawing I made) but were grounded?
And also, a few more questions on how iontophesis works. Let's say you put one pad on the forehead and the other on the back of the head as I said earlier. At what point does the electrical path of the electricity no longer affect the path of the compound being absorbed? To clarify, the electricity carries the chemical into the scalp and into the veins (in the setup where the pads are applied to the scalp and not the hair), but once the chemical reaches the veins, do the veins carry the compound through the body's normal circulatory path? Or does the electrical path to the other part of the scalp still have priority, or still have some influence on the drug's trajectory?
And also, a few more questions on how iontophesis works. Let's say you put one pad on the forehead and the other on the back of the head as I said earlier. At what point does the electrical path of the electricity no longer affect the path of the compound being absorbed? To clarify, the electricity carries the chemical into the scalp and into the veins (in the setup where the pads are applied to the scalp and not the hair), but once the chemical reaches the veins, do the veins carry the compound through the body's normal circulatory path? Or does the electrical path to the other part of the scalp still have priority, or still have some influence on the drug's trajectory?
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Hi Gone
Your questions are very interesting but It is not easy to imagine what could happen with it.The trajectory must be according to the resistivity of the skin.
Maybe this paper is usseful
http://www.scipharm.at/default.asp?id=1124&lid=2
Theres is a video showing the normal use of these apparatus, in this case for hand treatment.
Your questions are very interesting but It is not easy to imagine what could happen with it.The trajectory must be according to the resistivity of the skin.
Maybe this paper is usseful
http://www.scipharm.at/default.asp?id=1124&lid=2
Theres is a video showing the normal use of these apparatus, in this case for hand treatment.
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Thanks, that paper helped a lot. Look at pages 9, 10, 11, and 15.
Page 9 has a basic diagram for how iontophoresis works, however it still doesn't specify (the arrows aren't labeled) if the arrow underneath the skin represent the a) current, or b) drug's path, or both. I believe... that it is referencing the current. However this will be essential to our understanding. Edit: from every diagram I'm viewing on google images, the drug does NOT follow the path of the current to the other pad once it enters the bloodstream.
Pages 10 and 11 show the different transport routes for iontophoresis. According to the paper, "Ions prefer the route of shunt pathway. Hydrophilic molecules tend to localize the drug in hair follicles."
It's been shown earlier that liposomes were useful for getting drugs to the follicle through nanotechnology, but apparently I'll have to look further into this "hydrophilic" stuff.
Lastly, we have to understand the difference between ionic current and electric current, which I do not. Ionic current is capable of propelling and repelling drugs, while I am not sure if electric current is as well.
I will still have to consider, if iontophoresis is possible with one pad + ground... something that will not mess up the trajectory of the molecule down the hair follicle. I still haven't found anything on the internet describing what happens if you use and iontophoresis pad on hair... if you just let it sit on your hair but not your scalp. So I don't even know if that will work, but I don't see why it shouldn't. I feel like I'll need to ask someone in person about this perhaps
Page 9 has a basic diagram for how iontophoresis works, however it still doesn't specify (the arrows aren't labeled) if the arrow underneath the skin represent the a) current, or b) drug's path, or both. I believe... that it is referencing the current. However this will be essential to our understanding. Edit: from every diagram I'm viewing on google images, the drug does NOT follow the path of the current to the other pad once it enters the bloodstream.
Pages 10 and 11 show the different transport routes for iontophoresis. According to the paper, "Ions prefer the route of shunt pathway. Hydrophilic molecules tend to localize the drug in hair follicles."
It's been shown earlier that liposomes were useful for getting drugs to the follicle through nanotechnology, but apparently I'll have to look further into this "hydrophilic" stuff.
Lastly, we have to understand the difference between ionic current and electric current, which I do not. Ionic current is capable of propelling and repelling drugs, while I am not sure if electric current is as well.
I will still have to consider, if iontophoresis is possible with one pad + ground... something that will not mess up the trajectory of the molecule down the hair follicle. I still haven't found anything on the internet describing what happens if you use and iontophoresis pad on hair... if you just let it sit on your hair but not your scalp. So I don't even know if that will work, but I don't see why it shouldn't. I feel like I'll need to ask someone in person about this perhaps
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Very interestings thoughts, decades ago it was a type of Tesla Comb for hairgrowth, but it was unusefful.
http://www.zpzap.net/
Here is a paper relating electrostaic properties of human hair
journal.scconline.org/pdf/cc1977/cc028n09/p00549-p00569.pdf
http://www.zpzap.net/
Here is a paper relating electrostaic properties of human hair
journal.scconline.org/pdf/cc1977/cc028n09/p00549-p00569.pdf
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^Perhaps that'd help with the specific targeting then.
Why was the tesla comb not useful? Probably because it's just electrifying your head, right? Lol
I don't know who the f*** to ask about this, I kind of want to try iontophoresis and an Anti-androgen on my hair but I'd have to know for sure that it's using only the hair as a conduit, whether or not it would even reach the papilla, levels of systemic absorption, etc. If you guys know any experts on this I'll send him/her an e-mail. In the mean time I'll look for experts myself.
Why was the tesla comb not useful? Probably because it's just electrifying your head, right? Lol
I don't know who the f*** to ask about this, I kind of want to try iontophoresis and an Anti-androgen on my hair but I'd have to know for sure that it's using only the hair as a conduit, whether or not it would even reach the papilla, levels of systemic absorption, etc. If you guys know any experts on this I'll send him/her an e-mail. In the mean time I'll look for experts myself.
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I have been doing f*****g everything to ask questions about iontophoresis but no one is getting back to me. Obviously hair is an issue of mine and waiting for f*****g
nothing is driving me insane. There are a few therapy places I could call but I doubt they're going to know much about the specifics, and no one else has been answering. Do you guys know anyone you could ask? If iontophoresis would work on the hair shaft to carry drugs to the dermal papilla
nothing is driving me insane. There are a few therapy places I could call but I doubt they're going to know much about the specifics, and no one else has been answering. Do you guys know anyone you could ask? If iontophoresis would work on the hair shaft to carry drugs to the dermal papilla