Home-made Revivogen

vq0

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The ingredients of revivogen are:

SD Alcohol-40, Alpha Linolenic Acid, Gamma Linolenic Acid, Linoleic Acid, Oleic Acid, Palmitic Acid, Myristic Acid, Saw Palmetto Extract, Azelaic Acid, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Zinc Sulfate, Niacin (Vitamin B3), Tocopherol Acetate (Vitamin E)

So, essentially, it is super zix + Alpha Linolenic Acid, Gamma Linoleic Acid, Linoleic Acid, Oleic Acid, Palmitic Acid, Myristic Acid.

ALA is found in flaxseed oil
GLA is found in borage oil
Linoleic acid is found in grapeseed oil
Oleic acid is found in olive oil
Palmitic acid is found in palm oil
Myristic acid is found in palm kernel oil

Would blending the oils listed above with superzix using polysorbate 80 result in a similarly effective yet much cheaper product? I found the source oils on some scientific website and I'm wondering if anyone knows of any oils that have multiple acids. I would also add burdock root oil into the concoction for its beta-sis? Anyone know what acids are in burdock root oil? Thanks.
 

ugh

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I've heard that it is highly improbable that you could make revivogen at home...something about the fatty acids. There is thread about this from back in the day.
 

hair_tomorrow

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I do know that Joe has experimented a lot w/ his zix formulas - and he mentions that one mistake people make is to add thngs to it that won't gel.

You might be better off going w/ super zix and then adding / applying some of the other topicals separately.
 

CCS

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revivogen has fatty acids. Oils are fatty acids bound to glycerol. You can make the fatty acids yourself, but you need to read up on soap making and do some other steps.
 

Bryan

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collegechemistrystudent said:
revivogen has fatty acids. Oils are fatty acids bound to glycerol.

Exactly. Natural oils don't have the same effect as the free fatty acids in Revivogen.
 

vq0

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Would the actual free fatty acid content of an oil be zero or just insignificant? I assume that follicles cant perform the hydrolysis of the fat from the glycerol but would a small amount of alcohol topically be able to or do the oils actually have to be saponified?
 

CCS

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soponification or high pressure boiling. it would not happen topically. The reason saw palmetto helps a small amount is it has some free fatty acids in it, along with some beta sisterol. Revivogen should be a lot stronger than saw palmetto.
 

Armando Jose

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Dear friends;

It s possible that the action of Triacylglycerol hydrolase in the stratum corneum is important for releasing free fatty acids from natural oils. Here is a study regarding this issue (*)

OTOH, free fatty acids are “corrosivesâ€￾, it is sufficient look at the Material safety data sheet MSDS of these free acids. With the action of lipases, the amount of free fatty acids could be regulated.

Armando

(*)
a*** Biochem. 2001 Mar;290(2):179-85.
Use of the tape stripping technique for directly quantifying esterase activities in human stratum corneum.
Beisson F, Aoubala M, Marull S, Moustacas-Gardies AM, Voultoury R, Verger R, Arondel V.
Laboratoire de Lipolyse Enzymatique (UPR 9025 du CNRS), Institut de Biologie Structurale et Microbiologie du CNRS et de l'Université de la Méditerranée (FR 2248), 31 chemin Joseph Aiguier, 13402 Marseille Cedex 20, France.
The enzymes secreted in the intercellular spaces of stratum corneum (SC), the outermost layer of the epidermis, are thought to be involved in normal desquamation and skin barrier function. Their activity can barely be measured due to the difficulty in isolating enough biological material. Human SC layers were obtained from the forearm of healthy volunteers by the tape stripping technique. Assays for esterase activities were carried out in specially designed plates which contained the SC blotted on tape strips, using various fluorescent methylumbelliferone acyl esters as substrates. Triacylglycerol hydrolase activities were also studied by this method. By using radiolabeled triolein and fluorescent 4-methylumbelliferyl 7-oleate as substrates, true lipase activities could be detected and quantitated in SC at pH 5.5 and 7.5. These activities were shown to be strongly inhibited by tetrahydrolipstatin while this was not the case with 4-methylumbelliferyl 7-heptanoate. The method described here combines the painless tape stripping technique with a sensitive plate assay analysis. Since the whole process needs little manipulation, this method can permit rapid quantitation of multiple enzyme activities from a single strip. Therefore, it will permit the study of the involvement of enzyme activities in epidermis aging and skin pathologies. Copyright 2001 Academic Press.
PMID: 11237319 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
 

Bryan

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vq0 said:
Would the actual free fatty acid content of an oil be zero or just insignificant?

Insignificant for the most part, although evidently certain kinds of plants produce oils which are unusually high in free fatty acids. As CCS pointed out, saw palmetto is one of them, according to one study I saw.
 

Bryan

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Armando Jose said:
It s possible that the action of Triacylglycerol hydrolase in the stratum corneum is important for releasing free fatty acids from natural oils. Here is a study regarding this issue...

That's unlikely to be an important factor. Some of the researchers who did the original work in the use of fatty acids to inhibit 5a-reductase also did an experiment as part of a patent application that found that applying borage oil (rich in gamma-linolenic acid) to the forehead of a human test subject had very little effect in reducing sebum production, but applying a small amount of pure gamma-linolenic acid _did_ have a very significant effect in reducing sebum. If you wish, I can post the details of that experiment.
 

Armando Jose

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You are very kind, Bryan, I shall be very happy if I can read the results of such experiment.

By the way; do you know the concentration of free fatty acids in Revivogen?, and is there any oil carrier in the product?

Armando
 

Bryan

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Armando Jose said:
By the way; do you know the concentration of free fatty acids in Revivogen?, and is there any oil carrier in the product?

Several years ago when Revivogen first came out, they had given me some details of its composition, but I don't recall what they were exactly, not to mention that the ingredients have undoubtedly changed over the years. I believe the fatty acids in the original formula were something like 20% to 30% of the total, but I have no idea what they are now. I know they have (or at least used to have) ethanol in their vehicle, but I'm not aware of any carrier oils.

Armando Jose said:
You are very kind, Bryan, I shall be very happy if I can read the results of such experiment.

This would be U.S. Patent 5,605,929. "Methods and compositions for inhibiting 5.alpha.-reductase activity". Inventors: Liao; Shutsung (Chicago, IL), Liang; Tehming (Centerville, OH)

They give several examples of the use of fatty acids in androgen disorders; here is example number 9 near the end of the patent application:

Effects of Fatty Acids and Catechins on Sebum Production in a Human Model

Topical antiandrogenic activity of several fatty acid and catechin was first evaluated in the hamster flank organ assay or the rat assay. To further confirm the effectiveness of antiandrogenic compounds and suitability for human use, tests were performed on a human male subject. The ideal compounds for human treatment are those that are topically and locally active but do not show systemic antiandrogenic activity, especially in the cases involving young males. In the following example, two classes of compounds were tested by measuring sebum secretion from the forehead of an adult male treated topically.

A. METHODS

1. Determination of Forehead Sebum Production

A 63-year old Asian male volunteer was used to test and analyze sebum production from the forehead region. The forehead was washed thoroughly by soap twice and cleaned by 70% isopropyl alcohol twice. Sebum production was measured 30 to 60 minutes later by a sebum meter (Courage/Khazaka Electronic GmbH, Germany). The sebum meter tape probe (7 mm.times.8 mm) covered 56 mm.sup.2 area in each measurement. Ten measurements were made within the 4 cm square area (16 cm.sup.2) located at the middle of the left or right side forehead between the eyebrow and the hair line.

The sebum meter detected the difference in the transparency of the tape before and after the tape was placed on the forehead for 30 seconds and expressed the difference in an arbitrary number (S-value) between 0 to 300 (or higher). S-values of sebum accumulated on the foreheads of men are usually 200 to 300. Skin surface on hands usually showed a very low number (5 to 20). The S-value for forehead immediately after washing was less than 5. For men, the S-value gradually increased to about 50 within 30 minutes after washing and reached 100 to 200 in 45 minutes to 55 minutes.

To determine the rate of sebum production, the left and the right forehead areas were measured alternatively and each time at the comparable areas on the two sides. Ten measurements on each side (i.e., 20 measurements for two sides) could take about 15-20 minutes and the sebum-values ranged between 30 to 200. The S-values were different considerably at different areas of the forehead and could be influenced by environmental, including weather, diet, and physiological conditions. However, the ratio of the total S-value (the sum of 10 measurements) for the left and the total S-value for the right forehead was constant. For the Asian male tested in this experiment, the L/R ratios measured over a six month's period was within 1.15 to 1.38 if the S-values were determined 30 to 50 minutes after the forehead was washed thoroughly. Therefore, compounds applied to the left forehead that reduced the L/R ratio to lower than 1.1 were considered as topically active agents for suppression of sebum production.

B. RESULTS

1. .gamma.-LA Inhibition of Human Forehead Sebum

In the experiment shown in FIG. 24, 0.2 ml of borage oil (containing 18% of .gamma.LA) in a gel capsule was applied to the left forehead twice daily for 23 days. During this period, L/R ratio reduced from 1.28.+-.0.03 down to 1.05.+-.0.01. After the borage oil treatment was stopped, the L/R ratio returned to 1.20.+-.0.14. The effect of borage oil on the sebum production on the left forehead was relatively small, possibly due to the fact that most .gamma.LA in the borage oil was in the form of triglyceride that did not inhibit 5.alpha.-reductase (see Table 2). Free acid released from the glyceride by nonenzymic or enzymic action was probably responsible for the effect.

After the borage oil application was stopped and the L/R ratio recovered to 1.33, 20 mg of pure .gamma.-LA was applied to the left forehead twice each day for 6 days. The L/R ratio decreased to 0.22 during this period. After the .gamma.-LA application was stopped, the L/R ratio recovered slowly to 1.20.+-.0.14 over the period of 16 days. The finding clearly showed that .gamma.-LA was superior than borage oil in quickly suppressing sebum production from forehead of a human male subject.

2. Catechin Inhibition of Human Forehead Sebum Production

Twenty mg of (-)epigallocatechin gallate (EGCG) in 0.2 ml 70% ethanol was applied to the left forehead twice a day for 6 days (FIG. 25). The L/R ratio decrease from 1.20.+-.0.02 to 0.71.+-.0.04 during this period. After the EGCG treatment was stopped, the L/R ratio gradually recovered to 1.19.+-.0.02 within 16 days. Subsequent treatment of the left forehead with 20 mg (-)epicatechin in 0.2 ml 70% ethanol twice a day for 6 days reduced the L/R ratio to 1.02.+-.0.1. After the application was stopped, the L/R ratio gradually increased to the normal value of 1.21.+-.0.01 in 10 days. Clearly EGCG was more effective in reducing the sebum production from forehead than (-)epicatechin.
 

vq0

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thanks for the informative post bryan. I am going to try superzix and I was wondering if i could add more saw palmetto to the regular formula (more free fatty acids are better right)?
 

CCS

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just free the fatty acids in some borage or flax or safflower oil. You will get much better results than the saw palmetto. Also use some EGCG (androgen receptor blocker).

Bryan, how strong do you think EGCG is as an androgen receptor blocker, compared to spironolactone?

It is a lot cheaper than RU, and it is available in high concentrations, unlike spironolactone pills.
 

vq0

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According to my research, to saponify an oil I have to use an alcohol (methanol), sodium hydroxide and column chromatography. This is too complex a procedure and the chemicals are not readily available. Please let me know if you know of a simpler way with readily available chemicals. I will try adding my green tea extract to the superzix. Any recommendation as to how much i should add?
 

Bryan

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vq0 said:
I am going to try superzix and I was wondering if i could add more saw palmetto to the regular formula (more free fatty acids are better right)?

I suppose it might be helpful, although I've always wondered why there's such a lack of serious study on the effects of topical saw palmetto...
 

Bryan

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collegechemistrystudent said:
Bryan, how strong do you think EGCG is as an androgen receptor blocker, compared to spironolactone?

The available (limited) evidence would seem to suggest that EGCG is more effective than spironolactone, although I'd certainly like to see a DIRECT comparison between the two, under the exact same testing protocol.

There was that astonishing 97% inhibition of DHT-stimulated hamster flank-organ growth by EGCG in one study, which I still have trouble believing! :) That contrasts with roughly ~30% or so inhibitions of T-stimulated flank-organ growth by spironolactone in other typical hamster studies.

And the EGCG did moderately well at reducing sebum in the human test above, too, whereas I can show you at least one study with topical spironolactone in humans in which there was no measurable effect on sebum production at all.

Nevertheless, I'd still like to see a direct comparison between the two.
 

CCS

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vq0 said:
According to my research, to saponify an oil I have to use an alcohol (methanol), sodium hydroxide and column chromatography. This is too complex a procedure and the chemicals are not readily available. Please let me know if you know of a simpler way with readily available chemicals. I will try adding my green tea extract to the superzix. Any recommendation as to how much i should add?

BS. You just need lye, oil, and water. You can increase the surface area of interaction if you have some starter soap to get everything mixed together. Heat speeds it up. Old Baldy posted a method. But after it is soaponified, I need to removed the glycerol and add hydrochloric acid to get free fatty acids. I doubt Old Baldy's link says how to do that.
 

CCS

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Bryan said:
collegechemistrystudent said:
Bryan, how strong do you think EGCG is as an androgen receptor blocker, compared to spironolactone?

There was that astonishing 97% inhibition of DHT-stimulated hamster flank-organ growth by EGCG in one study, which I still have trouble believing! :)

Where the hampster's castrated? If so, it blocked 97% of androgen activity. If not, then it did not additionally block the native androgen activity.

I like EGCG because you can buy it pure. I think 30 100mg pills are $12. That is a lot cheaper than RU. Green tea has it, but I don't know how the other stuff affects absorption of the EGCG.

I want to make my own fatty acids, and then use polysorbate 80 to dissolve the EGCG in it, and maybe use PG and ethanol and some other stuff to make a topical. Then add some apple poly in there as a stimulant.

I know castration just stops hair loss, and RU is 80% as strong as castration, but I think RU combined with internal finasteride would be stronger than castration. I think internal finasteride combined with topical fatty acids would be stronger than dutasteride. Put the EGCG in there, and you get a cheap combo that is better than castration. Then apple poly mixed with retin-A and minoxidil can be applied in the day, with the greasy stuff at night.
 

Bryan

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collegechemistrystudent said:
Where the hampster's castrated?

Yes, they used castrated male hamsters.

collegechemistrystudent said:
I like EGCG because you can buy it pure. I think 30 100mg pills are $12.

Well, relatively pure. Those concentrated green tea extracts are typically rich in EGCG, but I've never seen a source for the pure chemical itself. Have you?

collegechemistrystudent said:
I know castration just stops hair loss, and RU is 80% as strong as castration, but I think RU combined with internal finasteride would be stronger than castration.

Could conveivably be! :)

collegechemistrystudent said:
I think internal finasteride combined with topical fatty acids would be stronger than dutasteride. Put the EGCG in there, and you get a cheap combo that is better than castration.

Yeah, maybe, although I think it's fairly likely that the human scalp simply doesn't absorb these substances (RU, fatty acids, and especially EGCG) as well as rodent skin does, so the results are unlikely to be as dramatic as what you might expect from using the animal experiments as a guide.
 
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