El Famoso "safe Zone" That Doesn't Thin

Koupka

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MeDK

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Why don't you read your own links?

A) you’ve developed a medical or scalp condition (infection) causing hair loss
B) you are taking medication where hair loss is a potential side effect
C) Transplanted hair was harvested/extracted from non-safe areas of the scalp

Hi there, this is certainly unusual. Whilst the quality of your hair may deteriorate over many years, the follicles that have been transplanted should not start to fall out. One could question whether the hair transplanted was taken from an area outside your donor zone. I would suggest you revisit your surgeon to review your hair and the result.

but most says its unusual
 

Koupka

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Why don't you read your own links?

A) you’ve developed a medical or scalp condition (infection) causing hair loss
B) you are taking medication where hair loss is a potential side effect
C) Transplanted hair was harvested/extracted from non-safe areas of the scalp

Hi there, this is certainly unusual. Whilst the quality of your hair may deteriorate over many years, the follicles that have been transplanted should not start to fall out. One could question whether the hair transplanted was taken from an area outside your donor zone. I would suggest you revisit your surgeon to review your hair and the result.

but most says its unusual

A) the medical these men have is described as Androgenetic Alopecia.
B) Come on, it's their fault of course, they are taking a treatment, and only the hair from the top of their scalp is falling
C) 3000+ grafts transplanted out of the safe zone starting to thin even before where it has be taken ? Really ? Hilarious.

Another rare varient are patients who've had a successful hair transplant procedure and enjoyed a couple of years of thick growth. Then seemingly out of no where the transplanted hair begins to thin. This has happened with at least 2 of my pateints in the past that I know of. In this case the best treatment is to implant more hair to make up for the volume difference.
One of my patients who posts on the forums by the name of Dai Vernon was an excellent example of this phenomenon. We did 2 procedures on him that looked excellent for almost 3 years. Then, the hair transplant hair miniturized or thinned out. The way we treated it was by packing in more hair between the existing hair transplant hairs. That did the trick and his final result was excellent. I'll dig up the links to his photos and post here later today.

This surgeon admit that the transplanted hairs miniaturize in some case.
Wait for some more years and it won't be only in "some case".

Dozens of report like this : https://www.qwant.com/?q=loosing transplanted hair&t=web
 

Koupka

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I hate to tell you this but having more hair transplants will not be a permanent fix to your problem. I spent about $18,000 on hair transplants and I figure I have lost at least half of them. Almost all of the "plugs" I had done in the 90's are no longer producing hair. Taking propecia slows the process a bit, but does not prevent it. I have been told that if you have some natural thinning on the sides of your head where the donor sites are, then you are more likely to have this problem of losing hair transplants. The hair transplant industry says this problem is rare, but what would you expect them to say?

I figure that I may need to wear a hairpiece eventually. Thanks to the scarring and pitting of my scalp, just having denuded skin on the top of my head is not an option. The thinning is progressing inexorably and I have no intention of wasting money on more transplants. In any case, I do not have a lot of donor area left. Unfortunately, I think you will also be wasting your money as well if you have more transplants.
Posted August 28, 2013

"transplant is a waste of money."
 

BetaBoy

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Haven’t seen any literature that suggests hair follicles from the occipital are somehow genetically resistant to the effects of androgens. From what I understand these follicles simply have less ARs and 5AR, so they still are susceptible to miniturising but most likely at a slower rate.
 

verne2k

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because that theory is just bullshit. follicles are the same, it's the environment around them that changes
 

Koupka

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Haven’t seen any literature that suggests hair follicles from the occipital are somehow genetically resistant to the effects of androgens. From what I understand these follicles simply have less ARs and 5AR, so they still are susceptible to miniturising but most likely at a slower rate.

the only studies i've seen about genes expression between occipital and temporal follicules were about inflammation. That's all the difference at a gene level there exist between those two kind of follicule, their inflammatory reaction expression.
 

Mandar kumthekar

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There is no safe zone for bald men. The donor are hairs are less equipped with androgen receptors and so would take much longer time to fall out . if you see people in advanced stage of balding you will see there donor is also thin as compared to non bald people. In have come to conclusion that all hairs are DHT sensitive with different degree of sensitivity .if given enough all time a bald person would we total hairless on scalp.
 

Koupka

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There is no safe zone for bald men. The donor are hairs are less equipped with androgen receptors and so would take much longer time to fall out . if you see people in advanced stage of balding you will see there donor is also thin as compared to non bald people. In have come to conclusion that all hairs are DHT sensitive with different degree of sensitivity .if given enough all time a bald person would we total hairless on scalp.

you're joking, right ?
 

BalderBaldyBald

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For the last time, in the 70's they grafted balding hair (those from the top) to the arm of the same person...

Guess what ? Hair on arm miniaturized and felt at same rate from those still on top of the scalp

It was 50 years ago now...and people still talking about those looney theories


Problems ARE (cause they are legion) mostly located in the hair follicle itself or hair bulge, reservoir of ephitelial stem cells

PS : Same was done with hair from donor area....did not fell on arm
 

BetaBoy

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For the last time, in the 70's they grafted balding hair (those from the top) to the arm of the same person...

Guess what ? Hair on arm miniaturized and felt at same rate from those still on top of the scalp

It was 50 years ago now...and people still talking about those looney theories


Problems ARE (cause they are legion) mostly located in the hair follicle itself or hair bulge, reservoir of ephitelial stem cells

PS : Same was done with hair from donor area....did not fell on arm

Can you link the study, hear this study thrown about a lot on here but never actually read it.
 

Dhldan

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Does this mean that we’re fucked since u cant change the shape of ur skull or anything in terms of in environment?

That’s only if skull/scalp shade is the main cause & not hormones/ etc tho.
 

Armando Jose

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Problems ARE (cause they are legion) mostly located in the hair follicle itself or hair bulge, reservoir of ephitelial stem cells
100% agree, this area can be affected by the enviroment and inflammation, also it explain miniaturization hair in common baldness

people still talking about those looney theories

androgenetic theory among them
 

verne2k

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For the last time, in the 70's they grafted balding hair (those from the top) to the arm of the same person...

Guess what ? Hair on arm miniaturized and felt at same rate from those still on top of the scalp

It was 50 years ago now...and people still talking about those looney theories


Problems ARE (cause they are legion) mostly located in the hair follicle itself or hair bulge, reservoir of ephitelial stem cells

PS : Same was done with hair from donor area....did not fell on arm


there is a more recent study that showed that miniaturized hairs from bald areas grow back to full thickness if transplanted in other areas of the body...
 

BetaBoy

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thats why some people can inject steroids but still don't thin around the donor area loll.. there is no scientific study that suggests environment is the case, non allow to be conclusive. the scientists are on in this thread again, bro science

tbh I’m highly sceptical of people being able to exogenously increase androgens without any effect to hairs, remember seeing one study that suggested any hairs on the body would undergo apoptosis when given sufficient amounts of androgens in vitro.
 

Koupka

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For the last time, in the 70's they grafted balding hair (those from the top) to the arm of the same person...

Guess what ? Hair on arm miniaturized and felt at same rate from those still on top of the scalp

It was 50 years ago now...and people still talking about those looney theories


Problems ARE (cause they are legion) mostly located in the hair follicle itself or hair bulge, reservoir of ephitelial stem cells

PS : Same was done with hair from donor area....did not fell on arm

godwin point.
Same and same study being "thrown" every time we speak about donor/balding site.
But no one have ever red it. Just the title.
The transplant surgeon took follicules from donor and balding site to the armpit.
Guess what ? Graft don't really like to be moved, and if the density isn't sufficient, the survival rate is miserable.
And that's what happen. When you take a graft from the back of the head in fut, there's like 3-4 hairs in this graft, while when you take a graft from a balding site, there's only 1 hair, or 2 if you 're lucky.
This explain the terrible survival rate of a balding graft, they just die because of insufficient density of hair.
The surgeon misunderstood his observation, and it has been revocated by multiples recent studies where the hair were transplanted into mice, or other parts of the body and they were doing super well.

As for information, DHT level in mice and humans are somewhat the same from what i've red, there's a study about androgen range in mice, easely foundable.
 
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