Effects of ejaculation or Propecia on mood and sleep.

[youngbaldie]

Could somebody with a scientific background fill me on the effects of ejaculation on the brain, mood, sleep, etc.? And what neurotransmitters are affected?

I am curious to know specifically the effects, if any, on GABA receptors. Perhaps, when ejaculation, or frequent ejaculation occurs, there is some possible effect here.

The reason I suspect a link, whether positive or negative, is because 5 alpha reductase results in converting progesterone to allopregnanolone which has an effect on GABA. It is speculated that finasteride for instance could possibly worsen existing sleep or anxiety disorders by blocking this conversion, thus inhibiting allopregnanolone.

The reason I bring up this example is because it clearly shows that yes, certain drugs that effect sex hormones and liver enzymes may also effect mood. This is well known.

So why is it so hard to believe that ejaculation itself may have some effect on GABA receptors? Afterall, when you ejaculate, you immediately feel euphoria for a short period, followed by fatigue. And there is a tolerance that builds up as well, if you ejaculate frequently, you experience less euphoria. If you ejaculate rarely, the euphoria from orgasim is more profound. And yet, when resisting ejaculation for prolonged periods, anxiety results, but this could possibly be due to long term addiction to sex?

 

[docj077]

As far as I know, Finasteride has no (to very little) effect on the five alpha reductase type I isoenzyme. Most of its effects are limited to the type II isoenzyme. Fortunately for propecia users, the type II isoenzyme does not seem to exist in the brain where the reduction of progesterone is necessary to eventually form allopregnanolone.

Dutasteride is another story, however.

 

[youngbaldie]

As far as I know, Finasteride has no (to very little) effect on the five alpha reductase type I isoenzyme. Most of its effects are limited to the type II isoenzyme. Fortunately for propecia users, the type II isoenzyme does not seem to exist in the brain where the reduction of progesterone is necessary to eventually form allopregnanolone.

Dutasteride is another story, however.

Thats the impression that I got too, however I found this.

"Type II is not present in the brain. But allopregnanolone is metabolized by the type II in the blood and reaches the brain."

It was posted by the member Bismarck.

They have had a very interesting and somewhat disheartening discussion on the effects of 5AR inhibitors on alloprenanolone in this thread.

http://www.hairlosstalk.com/discussions ... c&start=10

 

[youngbaldie]

Actually, after reading that entire thread, I think the topic of my post here should change. I do believe now strongly that finasteride can lead to brain fog and anxiety.

I believe strongly also that now I may have a possible explanation for why Ambien seems to work wonderfully at certain times, but not at others.

When I took saw palmetto at 10 times the recommended dose for a month, my scalp itch decreased significantly. It was certainly not in my head. The change was like night and day. However, I felt more anxious on palmetto, had trouble concentrating, and had bad insomnia. And Ambien's typical powerful sedative effects were completely inhibited on the drug.

Got off palmetto for 1 week, took Ambien, and shockingly, the sedative effects increased dramatically. Again, clear, drastic change.

Began taking finasteride last week. I have now been on it for about 10 days, and I tried ambien again last night for the first time in 1 week (to rule out tolerance issues). Low and behold, ambien's sedative effects were again completely inhibited.

As we already know, finasteride inhibits type II 5AR (which may very well decrease blood levels without even effecting Type I which is found in the brain), and pametto which acts on both type II and type I.

Allopregnalone must be the culprit. This is why Ambien doesn't work with 5AR inhibitors. The effects of Ambien (zolpidem tartrate) are clearly described here.

"Zolpidem binds with high affinity to the α1 containing GABAA receptors, about 10-fold lower affinity for those containing the α2, α3-GABAA receptor subunits, and with no appreciable affinity for α5 subunit containing receptors.[20] Like the vast majority of benzodiazepine like molecules, zolpidem has no affinity for α4 and α6 subunit containing receptors.[21] Zolpidem positively modulates GABAA receptors, probably by increasing the GABAa receptor complexes apparent affinity for GABA, without effect desensitization, or peak current.[22]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zolpidem

Here is allopregnanolone explained:

3α,5α-Tetrahydroprogesterone known as Allopregnanolone or THP, is an important neurosteroid in the human brain. It is a metabolite of progesterone and a barbiturate-like modulator of central Gamma-Aminobutyric Acid (GABA) receptors that modify a range of behaviors, including the stress response. Allopregnanolone targets the GABA A receptor to reduce anxiety and create calm at times of stress. In the journal Nature Neuroscience, researchers led by Sheryl S Smith PhD, Professor of Physiology and Pharmacology at State University of New York Downstate Medical Center, reported findings demonstrating that the hormone allopregnanolone normally released in response to stress, actually reverses its effect at puberty and instead increases anxiety.[1]"


GABAA receptor explained:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GABAA_receptor

 

[youngbaldie]

I wonder what effect SSRI's would have in all of this. I have seen online people citing studies that SSRI's increase allopregnanolone 20x.

But what effect, if any, would this have if 5AR is being inhibited?

 

[tairian]

I've got to say saw palmetto has an affect on scalp itchiness, A hairloss product that I've been taking for awhile now contains mostly vitamins but one ingredient That stood out to me was saw palmetto and When I take it, My itchiness is basically non existent opposed to when I don't At times I feel like scratching my hairline off.

 

[CCS]

As far as I know, Finasteride has no (to very little) effect on the five alpha reductase type I isoenzyme. Most of its effects are limited to the type II isoenzyme. Fortunately for propecia users, the type II isoenzyme does not seem to exist in the brain where the reduction of progesterone is necessary to eventually form allopregnanolone.

Dutasteride is another story, however.

5ar affects more than just testosterone?

 

[badasshairday III]

I don't know why people are crazy enough to use dutasteride as their first option. IMO it should be a last option. :shock:

It is so crazy when you see 20 year olds jumping on the dutasteride bandwagon.

 

[docj077]

As far as I know, Finasteride has no (to very little) effect on the five alpha reductase type I isoenzyme. Most of its effects are limited to the type II isoenzyme. Fortunately for propecia users, the type II isoenzyme does not seem to exist in the brain where the reduction of progesterone is necessary to eventually form allopregnanolone.

Dutasteride is another story, however.

5ar affects more than just testosterone?

Yes.

 

[CCS]

As far as I know, Finasteride has no (to very little) effect on the five alpha reductase type I isoenzyme. Most of its effects are limited to the type II isoenzyme. Fortunately for propecia users, the type II isoenzyme does not seem to exist in the brain where the reduction of progesterone is necessary to eventually form allopregnanolone.

Dutasteride is another story, however.

5ar affects more than just testosterone?

Yes.

Well then just finasteride 0.5-1mg for me. I'll get extra help from my shampoo concoctions. Rogain foam is the only form of minoxidil other than shampoo that I'd use, but it is too expensive for me.