Did any of these herbs/supplements help you?

[flamingpie]

So i was on the propeciahelp board and was rounding up all the supplements some have used to help our shitty situation. Has anyone here used these and/or had success with them:

L-argenine
magnesium
vitamin D3
ginseng
ashwagandha
tribulus
horny goat weed

 

[flamingpie]

Re: Did any of these herbs help you?

....and also ZMA, which is pretty much just as zinc/magnesium supplement.

 

[Ende]

Be careful with HGW. I've just been talking with a guy who claims he overdosed on that supplement, and he has been having some of the same symptoms as PFS sufferers experience, for several weeks. That's why he came here.

 

[flamingpie]

thanks good to know. Any advice with the other supplements i mentioned?

 

[Ende]

I've no idea. There is a lot of information about zinc (ZMA) on this forum.

 

[Ende]

I've seen people on this forum talking about tribulus and l-arginine. Vitamin D3 too, in relation to the "PFS".

 

[Mens Rea]

So i was on the propeciahelp board and was rounding up all the supplements some have used to help our shitty situation. Has anyone here used these and/or had success with them:

L-argenine
magnesium
vitamin D3
ginseng
ashwagandha
tribulus
horny goat weed

My experience is that if your levels are wrong enough these will make little difference. So it depends on how damaged you are.

L-arginine is one of the most useful for sexual function IMO and even that is maginal for me. If i take one of these before bed i'll definately have noctural erections. L-arginine increases the nitric oxide which helps the blood flow to the penis basically.

Magnesium - no use for me personally however some claim it helped them with their mental fog.

Vitamin D3 - this is one that many people actually claim has helped them RECOVER. I wasn't so lucky. No real affect here.

Tribulus - Not bad. Similar to l-arginine (for me) although its completely different. Helps promote the GOOD estrogens as opposed to the bed. Similar to DIM in some ways. Tribulus is one of those herbs that does seem to appear in many people's recovery stroies but this may be a simple coincidence....

HGW- This is simply a weak PDE-inhibitor. Im not very sure of the other active ingredients. It does work but never to many appreciable levels (in comparison to cialis that is!!).

Enden, as regards someone getting symptoms from "overdosing" on this stuff i have to say that does sound utterly bizarre. The fact the guy felt the need to take a performance enhancing herb such as HGW might prove he already had problems that simply got worse. I can't possibly comment for sure, though. One definately shouldn't dismiss this, especially given the arrogance we ourselves get as "Post finasteride syndrome" sufferers. That said, I can personally vouch this didn't do me any harm or have i otherwise read of it doing harm beyond this guy. I didn't actually take much of it though - i probably should try it again.

 

[flamingpie]

thanks for the info guys.
Based on what you've both said i might give L-arginine and d3 a try...what are the recommended doses for our cases?

 

[Mens Rea]

thanks for the info guys.
Based on what you've both said i might give L-arginine and d3 a try...what are the recommended doses for our cases?

1000mg or so per day for the l-arginine. You could play around with this one, though.

As for d3. I recommend trying out "clinical" dosage as this is what is required to get any of the benefits that some claim.

Im talking abot 10,000iu's per day or even more. You'll only get that in places like here...

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Vitamin-D3-D-10-0 ... 35ad206119



I personally "loaded up" on it and took 50,000iu's for a week. I took it for over a month. I thought it helped a little but in hindsight i dont think so.

It is claimed that it helps boost testosterone believe it or not. I suppose it depends ALOT on if you're actually defecient on it whcih you probably are unless you're in the sun alot.

 

[Ende]

I read somewhere about a study on l-arginine and ED, where the subjects used 5g a day for 6 weeks or so.

Edit:

There have only been two studies to date, however, evaluating the effectiveness of L-arginine for erectile dysfunction.

One study involved 50 men who took L-arginine (5 grams a day) or a placebo. After six weeks, significantly more men taking L-arginine experienced an improvement in sexual function compared with men taking the placebo. Interestingly, it only benefited men who had initially low levels of nitric oxide.

Another study using a smaller dose of L-arginine and a shorter treatment duration found no benefit with L-arginine use. The study involved 32 men with erectile dysfunction who took oral L-arginine supplements (500 milligrams three times per day) or a placebo for 17 days. Oral L-arginine was no better than the placebo.

http://altmedicine.about.com/cs/conditi ... ysfunc.htm

 

[Mens Rea]

I read somewhere about a study on l-arginine and ED, where the subjects used 5g a day for 6 weeks or so.

Edit:

There have only been two studies to date, however, evaluating the effectiveness of L-arginine for erectile dysfunction.

One study involved 50 men who took L-arginine (5 grams a day) or a placebo. After six weeks, significantly more men taking L-arginine experienced an improvement in sexual function compared with men taking the placebo. Interestingly, it only benefited men who had initially low levels of nitric oxide.

Another study using a smaller dose of L-arginine and a shorter treatment duration found no benefit with L-arginine use. The study involved 32 men with erectile dysfunction who took oral L-arginine supplements (500 milligrams three times per day) or a placebo for 17 days. Oral L-arginine was no better than the placebo.

http://altmedicine.about.com/cs/conditi ... ysfunc.htm

That's interesting but definately something i believe. The doses required are potentially too big to impliment - atleast for a sustained period

L-arginine has shown similar results in rats but again, in terms of dosage - pound for pound, one needs to take alot of it. These high dosages aren't really researched for safety.

 

[Ende]

I wouldn't be afraid of using 5g a day for 6 weeks.

 

[Mens Rea]

I wouldn't be afraid of using 5g a day for 6 weeks.

Either would I. But the studies ive read you'd need serious dosages to get the affects the rats were getting (due to differential body weight, naturally).

And the problem is - what use is taking it for 6 weeks? There doesn't appear to be any indications that effects would sustain upon cessation.

It might help against atrophy, though so i suppose any dosage could be semi-useful in that regard.

 

[Ende]

I guess the results should maintain if something has caused nitric oxide deficiency, but of course it wouldn't - if it's a problem somewhere which causes this.

The question is; what causes nitric oxide deficiency?

 

[Mens Rea]

I guess the results should maintain if something has caused nitric oxide deficiency, but of course it wouldn't - if it's a problem somewhere which causes this.

The question is; what causes nitric oxide deficiency?

No idea!

 

[Mew]

The question is; what causes nitric oxide deficiency?

Finasteride does.

DHT mediates Nitric Oxide synthase release. You inhibit DHT when you take Finasteride. Therefore, you inhibit NO.

5-Alpha Reductase Inhibitors and Erectile Dysfunction: The Connection
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1 ... x/abstract

RESULTS: Sexual AEs are reported in clinical trials at rates of 2.1% to 38%. The most common sexual AE is ED, followed by EjD and decreased libido.

... A proposed mechanism for sexual dysfunction involves decreased nitric oxide synthase activity due to decreased dihydrotestosterone.

 

[Mens Rea]

The question is; what causes nitric oxide deficiency?

Finasteride does.

DHT mediates Nitric Oxide synthase release. You inhibit DHT when you take Finasteride. Therefore, you inhibit NO.



[quote:1aae15ic]5-Alpha Reductase Inhibitors and Erectile Dysfunction: The Connection
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1 ... x/abstract

RESULTS: Sexual AEs are reported in clinical trials at rates of 2.1% to 38%. The most common sexual AE is ED, followed by EjD and decreased libido.

... A proposed mechanism for sexual dysfunction involves decreased nitric oxide synthase activity due to decreased dihydrotestosterone.

[/quote:1aae15ic]

Yeah, i had no doubt finasteride manages to do so.

Basically because finasteride can manage to do just about anything in the line of sexual destruction as i know too well, first hand.

 

[Ende]

If so, I think I would like to try it, just to see if it makes any difference.

 

[Ende]

I just bought some 750 mg l-arginine tablets from healthspan.co.uk.
I'm planning to use 4500 mg once a day, before bed, for 3 weeks.

 

[Mens Rea]

Don't be expecting any miracles mate but im sure you'll notice it does make a small difference.