Cut and grow at the same time?

[Harie]

muscle you are using will not be burnt for energy before fat

That's untrue. Your body will suck the calories from wherever it needs to survive. Since fat is a mechanism that protects us against starvation, your body is less apt to release fat stores.

If what you said were true, you'd never lose muscle mass or strength while you were cutting.

 

[CCS]

gfhfdhdhgf

 

[CCS]

I have not gained weight because I don't eat enough. But I point to my recent 6 pack abs and cut physique as my authority source.

 

[mulder]

muscle you are using will not be burnt for energy before fat

That's untrue. Your body will suck the calories from wherever it needs to survive. Since fat is a mechanism that protects us against starvation, your body is less apt to release fat stores.

If what you said were true, you'd never lose muscle mass or strength while you were cutting.

you are both wrong. Muscle is not broken down by cortisol as fast as fat is, but it still is. And at higher cortisol levels, the two start to merge. For most guys doing fasting cardio or dieting, 10-30% of the mass lost is muscle, and the rest fat. If you do high intensity cardio before breakfast, the coritisol levels will get high enough to maybe approach 50-50.

I think the branch chain amino acids can be metabolised in the muscle. The rest have to go to the liver to be de-aminated first. The more testosterone you have at the time though, and the more sensitive your muscles are to the testosterone from previous workouts, and the more HGH you have, the more those amino acids will get put back on the muscle before getting taken out of the muscle cell. Cortisol breaks the protein, then the other stuff puts it back. That is why steroids are good for cutting.

As long as you keep your workouts under 1 hour, your testosterone levels should be good. But if you want your fasting cardio to go over an hour, like say 2 hours like I do, then I'd use a good anabolic steroid. Most of them are crap though. Sides outweigh the benifits. Exercise that is outside your ideal time/intensity range will lower your testosterone.

Muscle grouth is about stimulating hormone response, making your muscles sensitive to those hormones, and giving them fuel at the right time, but not so much that you put on more fat than muscle. My sister's boyfriend thinks his 4 hours high intensity workouts are the way to go, and he does not gain mass. He gained 15 pounds in 5 years, and seems to think his creatine water weight was fast muscle grouth. More is not better, though you do have to really push yourself during those 45 minutes.

Interesting. Cortisol tends to be highest during the morning as well eh? Another reason for low intensity when doing fasted cardio. I already usually do my most intense cardio in the evenings after weights, and consuming some carbs and protein and a little break, when cortisol would presumably be at its lowest. Excellent.

 

[Harie]

muscle you are using will not be burnt for energy before fat

That's untrue. Your body will suck the calories from wherever it needs to survive. Since fat is a mechanism that protects us against starvation, your body is less apt to release fat stores.

If what you said were true, you'd never lose muscle mass or strength while you were cutting.

you are both wrong. Muscle is not broken down by cortisol as fast as fat is, but it still is. And at higher cortisol levels, the two start to merge. For most guys doing fasting cardio or dieting, 10-30% of the mass lost is muscle, and the rest fat. If you do high intensity cardio before breakfast, the coritisol levels will get high enough to maybe approach 50-50.

I think the branch chain amino acids can be metabolised in the muscle. The rest have to go to the liver to be de-aminated first. The more testosterone you have at the time though, and the more sensitive your muscles are to the testosterone from previous workouts, and the more HGH you have, the more those amino acids will get put back on the muscle before getting taken out of the muscle cell. Cortisol breaks the protein, then the other stuff puts it back. That is why steroids are good for cutting.

As long as you keep your workouts under 1 hour, your testosterone levels should be good. But if you want your fasting cardio to go over an hour, like say 2 hours like I do, then I'd use a good anabolic steroid. Most of them are crap though. Sides outweigh the benifits. Exercise that is outside your ideal time/intensity range will lower your testosterone.

Muscle grouth is about stimulating hormone response, making your muscles sensitive to those hormones, and giving them fuel at the right time, but not so much that you put on more fat than muscle. My sister's boyfriend thinks his 4 hours high intensity workouts are the way to go, and he does not gain mass. He gained 15 pounds in 5 years, and seems to think his creatine water weight was fast muscle grouth. More is not better, though you do have to really push yourself during those 45 minutes.

I wasn't talking about cardio or anything. PS said that muscle you use won't be burned. I was just addressing that.

 

[powersam]

muscle you are using will not be burnt for energy before fat

That's untrue. Your body will suck the calories from wherever it needs to survive. Since fat is a mechanism that protects us against starvation, your body is less apt to release fat stores.

If what you said were true, you'd never lose muscle mass or strength while you were cutting.

if you are eating regularly and frequently you will burn fat before you burn muscle that you are using. the starvation thing doesnt come into play unless you starve yourself oddly enough.

ccs: if you eat every 3 hours and sleep normally cortisol is not an issue.

 

[Harie]

if you are eating regularly and frequently you will burn fat before you burn muscle that you are using. the starvation thing doesnt come into play unless you starve yourself oddly enough.

Whenever you're in a calorie deficit, your body has to get the energy from somewhere. Hence why all diets result in muscle loss, especially when combined with cardio. Dieting makes you become catabolic. Catabolic = muscle loss. Sure, you'll lose fat too, but you also lose muscle. The trick with dieting is to minimize the muscle loss and maximize fat loss.

A few points to think about:

If your body didn't also burn muscle while you were in a calorie deficit, why would anyone have invented cutting steroids?

With your definition, as long as I worked out a lot, I could drop the calories as low as I possibly could because my body would never burn muscle.


Granted, if you eat a lot of protein and lift weights, your muscle loss will be minimized while you're cutting, but you will still lose musle.

 

[CCS]

muscle you are using will not be burnt for energy before fat

That's untrue. Your body will suck the calories from wherever it needs to survive. Since fat is a mechanism that protects us against starvation, your body is less apt to release fat stores.

If what you said were true, you'd never lose muscle mass or strength while you were cutting.

if you are eating regularly and frequently you will burn fat before you burn muscle that you are using. the starvation thing doesnt come into play unless you starve yourself oddly enough.

ccs: if you eat every 3 hours and sleep normally cortisol is not an issue.

I don't think cortisol is ever an issue. But you don't burn much fat unless you empty your glycogen. I prefer to burn it in an hour or two of light cardio, rather than 5 hours of fasting.

 

[CCS]

hairy, you are mistaken. You are right that you lose muscle when dieting, but it is at worst 50% muscle, and 50% fat. 10-30% is more normal, depending on hormone levels.

 

[mulder]

I would think that whether you're burning fat or muscle has a lot to do with how close you are to max muscular development and how much blubber you have on you. I do think that most people in vast majority of exercise situations are burning a lot more fat than muscle- probably on a 4 or 5 to 1 ratio. Even so doesn't hurt to take some supps and keep the exercises in the 'fat burning' range to make your cut as cleas as possible.

 

[Felk]

muscle you are using will not be burnt for energy before fat

That's untrue. Your body will suck the calories from wherever it needs to survive. Since fat is a mechanism that protects us against starvation, your body is less apt to release fat stores.

If what you said were true, you'd never lose muscle mass or strength while you were cutting.

if you are eating regularly and frequently you will burn fat before you burn muscle that you are using. the starvation thing doesnt come into play unless you starve yourself oddly enough.

ccs: if you eat every 3 hours and sleep normally cortisol is not an issue.

I don't think cortisol is ever an issue. But you don't burn much fat unless you empty your glycogen. I prefer to burn it in an hour or two of light cardio, rather than 5 hours of fasting.

When it's very high - f*** yes it is.

One of cortisol's major functions is the conversion of body protein to glucose. Muscle depletion is a feature of high cortisol levels.

Ever seen someone with Cushing's Sydrome? It's a condition of hypercortisolism. Muscles deteriorate and certain adipose sites receive fat , leading to central obesity and "buffalo humps." Skin becomes so thin abdominal striae develop, capillaries show through and burst easily. Hair also thins greatly, however this is more likely due to the hyperandrogenism when Cushing's is caused by a pituitary or adrenal tumour.

 

[CCS]

corisol does not turn muscle to sugar. It makes muscle release amino acids into the blood, which are then turned to sugar by the liver. To a greater extent, it also makes fat cells release fatty acids into the blood.

If there is more cortisol than the energy demands, all the excess fat and protein is turned to excess sugar by the liver, which then is put into the fat cells by insulin. So high cortisol still liberates more fat than muscle. But all this just goes back to the fat cells because it is not getting burned.

I don't know if that syndrome is when people make too much cortisol, or if it is when the excess exceeds a certain amount. Our blood sugar has ups and downs all the time, and those could result in small muscle to fat conversions if we stop excercise right away and the excess blood sugar is put into the fat stores. I don't know how much cortisol increases with time during a fat burn, but I'd think it would increase enough to just keep the blood sugar levels stable.