Breezula update 2022 June apparently they are doing trials very soon

[Min0]

with a receptor antagonist id find it impossible that the levels don't go back to normal. there is lots of data on cancer studies and androgen deprivation therapy where people take large quantities of extremely potent anti androgens over many years and their T comes back. with a tiny dose topically applied I find that incredibly impossible. the only way this could even work is through the HPA axis and you can easily check that by checking LH and FSH as you said. however I can tell you as someone who also had long term sides from finasteride usage, the gonad hormones where never the problem and I got them tested excessively. my hormones always came back to the exact same

But CB might have fucked with my HPA axis.
And if that’s the case I might enter a new degraded steady state that I can’t break out of back to my usual levels.
I remember when I was on pyri I could immediately feel my libido back when I stopped it. It’s only when I got on CB where I needed more time to recover each time
And that time seemed to be increasing with each cycle.
I just hope if that’s the case I can get back to my usual levels using some drugs

 

[Modill]

At this time my worry is to get back my max libido back because I’m not there yet.
I just noticed that my beard isn’t growing as fast as it used to after a shave, usually if I don’t shave for a week I get I thick beard . Now it’s not as thick.
So I’m wondering if the hormonal profile can permanently enter a new degraded steady state (less t more estrogen for example for a long time without drug intervention )

or by definition given enough time the levels will get back to the natural state ?

I’m thinking about going to the doctor to get a hormonal test prescription , I’m thinking my FSH, LH , Estrogen, T levels are completely fucked

Same to me. I didn't recover libido yet. Or CB fucked my body, or my anti-DHT shampoo is super strong.

 

[badnewsbearer]

But CB might have fucked with my HPA axis.
And if that’s the case I might enter a new degraded steady state that I can’t break out of back to my usual levels.
I remember when I was on pyri I could immediately feel my libido back when I stopped it. It’s only when I got on CB where I needed more time to recover each time
And that time seemed to be increasing with each cycle.
I just hope if that’s the case I can get back to my usual levels using some drugs

what a bunch of hypochondria bullshit. completely unfounded in science and how the HPA axis works and what they showed in their HPA studies. if they never mentioned it in their trial data(nobody had HPA issues on the high dose in the alopecia trial) then you probably wouldn't have this side rn. imagine how unlucky you'd have to be to not only not tolerate any of the drugs which have been shown save in clinical studies but have sides that haven't even been observed in those studies. that quite something. but I know you do not believe in studies so then I guess everything is possible from that point on

a hint maybe, in all subjects that saw HPA axis suppression it returned to normal after 3 weeks

 

[badnewsbearer]

also thanks for completely ignoring the long *** post I made about vehicle and targeted delivery probably being the major issue. good luck with fluridil(which does not actually get degraded in blood immediately but only after 8 hours and has a higher affinity than flutamide) in your ethanol pg solution. I am sure that will work really well

btw how can you say CB studies are fake when you did not even use their purity level of drug and totally not the same vehicle? studies have a lot more weight than you are suggesting but that should be quite obvious to anyone

 

[Modill]

You DO look like an unhappy person honestly

 

[badnewsbearer]

You DO look like an unhappy person honestly

and you sound like an insane hypochrondria having sides that nobody out of 2000 people ever had in clinical studies and attributing it to a pharma conspiracy theory, suggesting drugs that are used for prepubertal kids with acne are "dangerous" when ever proof speaks against that. but just carry on, this forum is a total sh*t show at this point anyway. might as well rename it in "side effect talk" because not much research (e.g vehicle research) is discussed here anymore

 

[Min0]

also thanks for completely ignoring the long *** post I made about vehicle and targeted delivery probably being the major issue. good luck with fluridil(which does not actually get degraded in blood immediately but only after 8 hours and has a higher affinity than flutamide) in your ethanol pg solution. I am sure that will work really well

btw how can you say CB studies are fake when you did not even use their purity level of drug and totally not the same vehicle? studies have a lot more weight than you are suggesting but that should be quite obvious to anyone

bruh, I’m now 100% convinced that people from the future will look at dermatologists trying to treat pattern hairloss through the androgenic pathway like barbaric retards.
So I won’t lose more time trying to research this more than I did. And I already found posts of people who tried fluridil that complain about side effects so yeah it will probably kill my libido as well. But I have to try it. My last battle on this front. If lose I will capitulate

 

[Min0]

lab results came in :

FSH 1,75 IU/L (normal range 0.95 to 11.95)
LH 2,68 IU/L (normal range 0,57 à 12,07)
OESTRADIOL < 88 pmol/L (normal range < 88 to 161)
Testosterone 15,09 nmol/L (normal range 8,76 à 27,85 )

too bad i didn't take my hormonal test before to compare these results. nothing alarming it seems within the ranges

 

[Modill]

lab results came in :

FSH 1,75 IU/L (normal range 0.95 to 11.95)
LH 2,68 IU/L (normal range 0,57 à 12,07)
OESTRADIOL < 88 pmol/L (normal range < 88 to 161)
Testosterone 15,09 nmol/L (normal range 8,76 à 27,85 )

too bad i didn't take my hormonal test before to compare these results. nothing alarming it seems within the ranges

You didn’t check more hormones?

 

[Min0]

You didn’t check more hormones?

no, doctor only prescribed this after i insisted
he was dismssive, he said well you know what was the reason ! and that i just have to stay away from these drugs.

 

[lukedorian]

Be careful i have been using CB0301 for a year now from a compounding pharmacy, so no chance of fake underdosed crap, no anageninc nor kane nor nothing of that sort.
I am already on TRT injecting 60 mg of Test E twice weekly since 2017.
CB works since up until this point i has helped me into keeping my existing hair, i can also feel it thicker.
It clearly acts in very different way 5AR inhibitors do, since i am very sensitive to tanking my DHT i only take finasteride every 72 hours and a very small amount, minoxidil 20 mg topically daily.
So in all this time i haven’t feel any negstive impact on my libido or at least up until recently, i began using 50 mg but since this stuff is not out for the public i decided to lower it to 20 mg (the dose approved for acne).
Well for the past couple of months i have been noticing fat around my waist chest and i feel my legs losing muscle, granted i work out hard 4 x week and i’m very muscular
What bothers me the most is waking up at 2AM every singles day, i go to bed at 10 pm and have no issues falling asleep, also crazy cravings at that time of the night, worrysome to say the least, all this for the past couple of months.
I am a healthcare professional in my country so all the basics are covered, don’t drink don’t smoke and fir the most part no parties or staying up very late at night.
I have also noticed i have a hard time maintaining weight.
Winlevi is to be used for only 2 months at a time i believe and not for ever, so i decided to give this a break i still use min finasteride every 72 hours and minoxidil only 20 mg topically ( 50mg makes me feel weird also)
It has been a week since i stopped i can say i can now sleep thru the entire night but i still wake up tired i also get some drowziness and i notice recovery from workouts is harder, how ever seems like mental focus has improved and my mood is way better.
After 1 week off i notice my waist is getting better and overall i feel my muscles are getting harder again.
I believe i am suppressed i’ll draw bloods next week and get back with results, since in winlavi trial cases, guys who got suppressed recovered after 4 weeks.
Stuff works but at what cost, it would be great to know phase 2 or 3 results for this.
Be careful.

 

[lukedorian]

doesn’t cb lose its anti-androgen ability when it comes into contact with blood? How can there be sides?

It quickly hidrolizes into Cortexelone, it is very similar to Cortisol so you can still experiment cortisol like side effects from it (in sensitive individuals), after 1 year i can say my libido hasn´t take a hit, but other sh*t does.
Pyri is out of the question right now

 

[lukedorian]

like, are you even for real? you THINK it is more? as if they could not easily test the half life of a drug in blood serum? this is done in preclinical studies you hypochondriac. you are crazy if you think 1/3rd dose of CB gives heart issues(through the anti androgenic angle), this is the dose the children for acne use, over 1000 people in the phase 3 clinical trial and nobody has had these sides. and after 4 weeks? buying chemicals from a Chinese lab under unknown conditions and then complaining about heart related sides from a drug that has never shown this in any of the clinical studies is something

I also think heart related issues are completely non existant, there is a psycological component for sure, Premature ventricular contractions are very common and might get miscategorized as "Arrythmia" in theory they are but everyone experiment them at some time in the life and they are harmless

 

[lukedorian]

is it not crazy that there have been two large trials on hundreds of people showing no sexual sides and yet here on this forum it seems to be a totally normal occurrence?

the pattern is quite similar as with pyrilutamide, none of these sides in the studies but all over the internet during experiments. even if you could argue that a 100 person trial is too small to identify all side effects, the fact that the incidence is so high on these forums means that someone is definitely making sh*t up. its either Kintor or the people who sell this stuff online like Anagenic. I find it hard to believe that the studies are tampered with as CD is already approved for children with acne and pyrilutamide is applying for phase 2 in the US where such a fluke would most definitely be apparent. also they would ruin their finances by going forward with a product they know causes these issues.

its makes no sense for sides to be so rare that they dont show up in the study and then int he forum its super common. if one guy had them that'd be okay but the fact that about 50% seem to have them shows that either you all got fake stuff, the studies have actively been tampered with( because such a strong disagreement cannot be just a poor set up, you have to make an effort to not detect them)

its even more strange because nobody on the internet has ever reported on results with CB. so its odd that it would have a powerful enough effect on brain when it cant except any meaningful effect on the skin where it is directly applied especially because it metabolizes quite fast, not in the liver but the serum in fact so as soon as it hits the blood stream, making the amount in the brain and genital skin even less.

also especially because you all seem to be using a lower dose than the studies.


fact is that the majority on reddit does not report results on either of the medication. additionally, people who got sides on finasteride seem to mostly tolerate CB. but hair loss talk is where the 1/1000 seem to be all at

Isn´t winlevi meant to be used for a couple of months and not for life? i used CB for 1 year and i did not noticed sexual sides but i did notice cortisol related issues.

 

[lukedorian]

Yes,
Cortisol a bit low. I should have 18, but I have 6.
DHT 0,4. A bit low but enough to feel líbido.
Alkaline phosphatase, súper low. The doctor told me that there is no problem (doctors always say that, even if you are dying)
My líbido is recovering after almost 3 weeks.
@Min0 how are you? Still on Pyri?

Cortisol 6 is almost on the lower end, you might have gotten supressed indeed, you need more time, i´ll contact you on recuperarelpelo

 

[lukedorian]

how is the theory flawed? because if we actually read the studies then HPA axis suppression was very rarely observed and mostly in the children. in the hair loss study out of the 300 people nobody stopped therapy because of systemic issues. so obviously it is very rare. additionally out of the 300 people, 200 used a dose 3 time more than you two, 100 of them using even 6 times a higher dose. not a single report of sexual dysfunction. and you have the nerve to call CB a "dangerous drug". people have done group buys for half a decade and its always been said that there is no sides. only recently have the reports of insane anti androgen sensitivity gone up. but lets consider this. with your 2.5% dose applied to the scalp, you will have less serum CB than the average participant of the phase 3 acne study. that study included young kids going through puberty. and it was fine for them but an adult has "total libido destruction" on 1/3rd of the dose and even there out of hundreds nobody had that? im not saying its impossible to get this but to come here and claim all kinds of things about the drug and what side effects it has because obviously its the drug and not your utterly out of the ordinary sensitive body. also consider that you are both using a different vehicle, in fact alcohol at high amounts will almost ensure that most of it will go systemic. they did not use the minoxidil vehicle thats for sure. also consider that your CB is just laced. nobody ever had results with CB so I highly doubt that if it barely works when applied locally, that it will except strong anti androgenic effects at a completely different part of the body. HPA axis could happen but its probably very unlikely at 1/3rd of the usual treatment dose

I think this should be renamed in side effect talk at this point

The vehicle thing you mention might be key, since i mix it with minoxidil to make only 1 application a day, so the mixxing of things might have to do with pushing sides, makes sense hence it would be better for it to be released by kintor or whom ever owns the patent.
But again i think it is of the safest treatments since it took more than 10 months for me to feel sides and not sexual ones.

 

[lukedorian]

lab results came in :

FSH 1,75 IU/L (normal range 0.95 to 11.95)
LH 2,68 IU/L (normal range 0,57 à 12,07)
OESTRADIOL < 88 pmol/L (normal range < 88 to 161)
Testosterone 15,09 nmol/L (normal range 8,76 à 27,85 )

too bad i didn't take my hormonal test before to compare these results. nothing alarming it seems within the ranges

You need your cortisol also tested, your Estradiol is low, Estradiol is a big player in maintaining libido, you also need sexual hormone binding globuline levels tested, judging by LH, FSH you are not suppressed but they are still on the lower end
You 2 might be right after all and come from a state of Suppression, you only need time

 

[badnewsbearer]

Be careful i have been using CB0301 for a year now from a compounding pharmacy, so no chance of fake underdosed crap, no anageninc nor kane nor nothing of that sort.
I am already on TRT injecting 60 mg of Test E twice weekly since 2017.
CB works since up until this point i has helped me into keeping my existing hair, i can also feel it thicker.
It clearly acts in very different way 5AR inhibitors do, since i am very sensitive to tanking my DHT i only take finasteride every 72 hours and a very small amount, minoxidil 20 mg topically daily.
So in all this time i haven’t feel any negstive impact on my libido or at least up until recently, i began using 50 mg but since this stuff is not out for the public i decided to lower it to 20 mg (the dose approved for acne).
Well for the past couple of months i have been noticing fat around my waist chest and i feel my legs losing muscle, granted i work out hard 4 x week and i’m very muscular
What bothers me the most is waking up at 2AM every singles day, i go to bed at 10 pm and have no issues falling asleep, also crazy cravings at that time of the night, worrysome to say the least, all this for the past couple of months.
I am a healthcare professional in my country so all the basics are covered, don’t drink don’t smoke and fir the most part no parties or staying up very late at night.
I have also noticed i have a hard time maintaining weight.
Winlevi is to be used for only 2 months at a time i believe and not for ever, so i decided to give this a break i still use min finasteride every 72 hours and minoxidil only 20 mg topically ( 50mg makes me feel weird also)
It has been a week since i stopped i can say i can now sleep thru the entire night but i still wake up tired i also get some drowziness and i notice recovery from workouts is harder, how ever seems like mental focus has improved and my mood is way better.
After 1 week off i notice my waist is getting better and overall i feel my muscles are getting harder again.
I believe i am suppressed i’ll draw bloods next week and get back with results, since in winlavi trial cases, guys who got suppressed recovered after 4 weeks.
Stuff works but at what cost, it would be great to know phase 2 or 3 results for this.
Be careful.

upon a quick google search I found a surprising amount of people on reddit that have experienced systemic side effects from winlevi. many women having absent periods, weight gain etc.

thats crazy and sad. I was looking forward to CB and it has been praised since 2014, a crazy long 9 years now that its been studied. it stands for this industry like nothing else. 10 years of research for an extremely expensive product that works worse than finasteride, needs to be topically applied twice a day and still has systemic side effects in quite a few people. no long term data.

i realize they updated their website for phase 3 trials in 2023 H1 but I dont think they even need to do them anymore. this is a failed product. and I also dont believe Kintor anymore either, they have developed their drug with zero intelligence, its not targeted for skin at all, its just a f*****g RU analogue 20 years later. they have not even put a thought into the vehicle which is kind of insane if they use ethanol pg then they are officially a clown company. also zero confidence in their degrader.

what Kintor WILL achieve though is to make is even LESS attractive for other companies to develop truly innovative and solid products even for maintenance(not even that is possible in 2023). I really hope Kintor and sun pharma will go financially bankrupt before any of the drugs come out. because if they do, the game is over for new drugs within the next 10-15 years.

its actually crazy how little progress there has been made. every hype has been totally destroyed, its almost iconic at this point. not almost, it IS iconic.

I think its very rare to find a field where as a patient you are basically stuck with drugs from another century. I think there is none actually, sure other diseases are much worse and also underfunded and studied but there have been new drugs still. for this there has not been anything. its a meme at this point

 

[badnewsbearer]

for real though, is really nobody interested in vehicle research? imagine being able to use all those bullshit drugs that go systemic. making the research section actually the research section? I have provided so many papers and research, there is a massive amount of new research from 2018 to 2022 and nobody gives a rats *** about it. I dont understand it. sure its an effort to identity it, one must talk to people doing the research, find a compounding pharmacy to make it, test it, reformulate etc. but a proper delivery mechanism is very important I think.

 

[Modill]

for real though, is really nobody interested in vehicle research? imagine being able to use all those bullshit drugs that go systemic. making the research section actually the research section? I have provided so many papers and research, there is a massive amount of new research from 2018 to 2022 and nobody gives a rats *** about it. I dont understand it. sure its an effort to identity it, one must talk to people doing the research, find a compounding pharmacy to make it, test it, reformulate etc. but a proper delivery mechanism is very important I think.

What about you?