Any hairloss newbies up for a trial with aspirin and minoxidil?

beholder

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It is known that high-potency minoxidil causes immediate hairloss (shedding) during the first 1-3 months when used. This gets later replaced by somewhat steadier hair growth.

From trials with niacin is also known that as aspirin (acetylsalicylic acid) as NSAID causes lower levels of prostaglandins induced in strong niacin (vitamin B3) flushing. This means PGD2 gets lowered and also, unfortunately, the PGE2 along with the PGF2a.

From my own experience with long-term medium dose aspirin (250mg daily) I can see it stopped any significant hair loss. Interestingly enough, it also PROBABLY stopped any minoxidil shedding when I got into minoxidil 2-3 months ago. I am currently on my 3rd bottle of 2% minoxidil, have been using also 5% a month ago, which is hard to come by here. Using it twice daily with other stuff.

As for the shedding itself, I am quite sure I am not shedding at all from minoxidil, which I suspect is due to daily aspirin divided into two 125mg doses. I started with aspirin months ago before starting minoxidil use. My current hair loss/shedding is (and was) limited to a few hairs which stay on my fingers when applying gooey chemicals to hair skin and massaging it. This may be 10-30 hairs daily, tops. It is far from the reported 100-300 hairs daily some people report as minoxidil shedding.

I also need to note that I am in my high 30s and my production of testosterone may be starting to subsize. This means that for a 20yo man the aspirin may not work the same way as it does for me.

Therefore I propose following: we need to get a few newbies in for a trial of aspirin and minoxidil. They would start with a 1-month aspirin loading phase which would consist from 125mg of aspirin daily up to 250mg aspirin daily (everyone's tolerance to aspirin is different and there is a small possibility some people may get out of this trial due to gastric problems from prolonged medium-dose aspirin use). Once they are on their regular and well-tolerated aspirin dose, they start with minoxidil, looking for signs of growth and shedding. The experiences of people and the hair counts by various methods would be compared in this thread.

If we can estabilish at least anecdotic evidence that aspirin helps with initial shedding induced by minoxidil use, it would be of great help to a lot of people that are just starting to counter their hairloss. Needless to say this trial would be quite safe as aspirin is one of the most used and well tolerated drugs in existence of human medicine (which cannot be said about minoxidil which about every guy here has had on his head at some point). Who is in?

People to be self-excluded are: those having any aspirin-related problems; those having any minoxidil use history in the past 5 years; youngsters under 16; people with complete hair loss (a. totalis) or recent a. areata; any users of 5-alpha-reductase inhibitors incl. from herbal sources like Saw Palmetto.

The trial length would be 4 months. If you feel like you're up to the challenge and want to start with some hair regimen, here is your chance to achieve something else beside it - with experienced users watching over your efforts. Please post to this thread so we can organize. This is also a normal thread, I also welcome any opinions of other users here, no need to be included in the trial to post.
 

frenchy

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yea i think newbies are not quite confortable messing up with drugs for trials

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found this after quick search http://www.miamihair.com/blog/hair-loss-research/take-rogaine-or-aspirin-never-both/
 

beholder

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Thanks, I have suspected this. However, I think part of the problem is about PGE2 and PGD2 balance, so while lowering both by aspirin we're also going to stimulate PGE2 via minoxidil route at the same time.
Also, minoxidil also does stimulate blood flow into area doing this via entirely different mechanism than COX1/COX2 prostaglandin vasodilatory mechanism.
 

frenchy

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Thanks, I have suspected this. However, I think part of the problem is about PGE2 and PGD2 balance, so while lowering both by aspirin we're also going to stimulate PGE2 via minoxidil route at the same time.
well it seems to be the same path, so maybe not (?)

Also, minoxidil also does stimulate blood flow into area doing this via entirely different mechanism than COX1/COX2 prostaglandin vasodilatory mechanism.
yea, but not sure the blood flow plays a lot (?)
 

beholder

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What I wanted to say is that no aspirin will get COX-es to zero level. There will always be some COX1/COX2. You most certainly may achieve only partial suppression, let's say 50 to 60% (totally made up the numbers, this is just an example). The suppression is also definitely dose and time dependent. To fully disable COX-es you would have to have them knocked down (like in a mouse model). A fascinating article to read about all this is here: http://www.jci.org/articles/view/59262
And here abstract about only partial suppression of PGD2 using aspirin: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18223672
 

frenchy

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see your point but maybe using both will just maintain you to baseline pge2..
im probably saying something silly but wouldn't be better to take oral cetirizine for pdg2?
 

beholder

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what I am actually doing is that I am also applying topical cetirizine. So I am perhaps getting upturn in PGE2 and downturn in PGD2. Hopefully.
I did read some texts today and think I do need to tone it down with aspirin though. It's because of maintaining high levels of it may fk up my blood pressure and heart disease in the long term. I think it was good for virtually no shedding during the first 2 months of minoxidil but now I don't really need it anymore. Perhaps I will try it later as topical, it's trivial to make a solution out of it.
 

frenchy

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that is intresting, for how long have you been on this regimen?
 

Bad

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Will 10mg cetirizine a day be any help?
Isnt taking an aspirine a day dangerous?
 

beholder

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that is intresting, for how long have you been on this regimen?
Only for just about 2-3 months. But I've been on 250mg (that's half-tablet) of aspirin for much longer time than that and I have noticed stopping of any critical hair loss and growth of some short/thin lanugo hair. I am a diffuse thinner now so it was very unnoticeable, until one day I looked at it and said to myself: dammit, looks like I don't have any hair loss now. And I have decided to support the good trend with minoxidil.

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Will 10mg cetirizine a day be any help?
Isnt taking an aspirine a day dangerous?

There is an old topical cetirizine thread on this very forum, check it out:
http://www.hairlosstalk.com/interact/showthread.php/63625-Started-new-topical-cetirizine-regime-and-some-thoughts-about-stopping-Finasteride?p=1100618#post1100618

and no, I believe many asthma people take 10mg of oral cet daily and it's ok for them. It's recommended to take in the evening as it has a little sedative effect. Long-term usage (more than 3 months) is however not as clear.

The same about aspirin. Generally, it's quite safe medication. Normally I am not taking more than 1/2 tablet daily. But in the long term it may have consequences for heart disease and/or blood pressure so I am going to try tone it down a lot. I was taking aspirin for more than 1 year already for hair-unrelated condition.
 

Bad

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Only for just about 2-3 months. But I've been on 250mg (that's half-tablet) of aspirin for much longer time than that and I have noticed stopping of any critical hair loss and growth of some short/thin lanugo hair. I am a diffuse thinner now so it was very unnoticeable, until one day I looked at it and said to myself: dammit, looks like I don't have any hair loss now. And I have decided to support the good trend with minoxidil.

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There is an old topical cetirizine thread on this very forum, check it out:
http://www.hairlosstalk.com/interac...ut-stopping-Finasteride?p=1100618#post1100618

and no, I believe many asthma people take 10mg of oral cet daily and it's ok for them. It's recommended to take in the evening as it has a little sedative effect. Long-term usage (more than 3 months) is however not as clear.

The same about aspirin. Generally, it's quite safe medication. Normally I am not taking more than 1/2 tablet daily. But in the long term it may have consequences for heart disease and/or blood pressure so I am going to try tone it down a lot. I was taking aspirin for more than 1 year already for hair-unrelated condition.

But is there any benefit in just 10mg a day cetirizine? I can obtain it really easy, i use it sometimes for my allergies.
 

beholder

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There is no evidence to suggest that it does (contrary to popular belief).

I agree with above. However experiences of people from these forums suggest that it nearly as effective as a 5aR blocker finasteride.
 

bushbush

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I agree with above. However experiences of people from these forums suggest that it nearly as effective as a 5aR blocker finasteride.

Efficacy has no bearing on the underlying molecular mechanisms. Normalisation of prostaglandin levels is a possibility.

Citation: Garza et al., Prostaglandin D2 inhibits hair growth and is elevated in bald scalp of men with androgenetic alopecia. Science translational medicine. 2012

"Although minoxidil alters potassium channel kinetics (7), it is also known to increase production of PGE2 (37). Given the decreased amount of PGE2 present in bald scalp versus haired scalp (Fig. 2E), minoxidil may normalize PGE2 levels. Future studies should address whether minoxidil can concomitantly decrease PGD2 levels and thus normalize multiple prostaglandin species as a mechanism to improve Androgenetic Alopecia."
 
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