a few hairloss truths - for newbies especially

[lithebod]

Ive been in this hairloss "game" now for a little over 18 months which to some might not seem very long but I know when i started out I could have imagined what things would have been like this far down the road - anyhow this is my personal guide for those starting out like I was

1) The drug free approach

This tends to be favoured by those new to hairloss (usually the Nw1-2) who think (like I did) 'my situation isnt that bad yet -maybe I can use some of the natural stuff like revivogen and copper peptides' - if you are thinking this then all I can say is DON'T! The bottom line is male pattern baldness isnt something you can be clever about or reason with - there are only two proven treatments and we all know what they are - Ive been using copper peptides for 18 months now (12 months without finasteride) and still do but my hair was still deteriorating when I was using it with rev only.

2) Proctor and Lee

When you enter the world of HairLossTalk.com you will come across these names - at first it all sounds very exotic - Xandrox, Proxiphen, - but the truth is they are just versions of minoxidil with added ingredients - not to mention Nano - if you do visit these Drs websites do not be swayed by the rather matter of fact way they state that their products will work as well as finasteride or in some cases better - the fact is they are all still untested (apart from the minoxidil obviously) so again I think its unwise to use them as a main treatment - Ive been using spironolactone and still do (even though im using finasteride) only cos Im used to it now but there is no way to know wether its working or not.

3) Hey my non finasteride treatment is working! - ok this is where I sound like a finasteride groupie (which Im not) but this is exactly what i thought in the early days of using my "natural" approach - then I realised it wasnt that my treatment was working it was just that I was losing my hair gradually as I had done in the years previous - just because we suddenly acknowledge our male pattern baldness doesnt mean that it then speeds up - it just carries on as before - so those natural treatments might seem to be working but its proprably just the normal ebb and flow of your hairloss

4) Vitamins vitamins vitamins!

By all means pop some pills - I take green tea, msm and flax lignans but I dont consider these as part of my regimen as such and neither should you - little evidence they actually work for male pattern baldness but I believe there are other benifits to supplementation so if it happens to do something for my hair too then fine

If any one new to this has had these thoughts on how to treat their male pattern baldness Id urge you to think again. Right now Im just past the 6 month mark on finasteride - no miracles but its the only treatment ive used where I can honestly say I have seen a tangible slowdown in my hairloss (this kicked in after about month 4). I could find that finasteride stops or doesnt work that well for me but the truth of it is until the good stuff comes along (HM) this really is pretty much the only viable option - if I had realised that 18 months ago Id probrably have much more hair on my head as I type this message.

 

[Old Baldy]

You didn't get results with Dr. Proctor's product(s)? How long did you use them?

Btw, I disagree with you in a substantial way. I'm the type that gravitates to the "kitchen sink" approach.

Since there is no cure for male pattern baldness I say "the more the merrier". But who knows?! :?

I stopped using finasteride. because a very reputable hairloss doctor told me it isn't recommended for men over 50 years old. Too much chance for libido problems and, more importantly, a greater chance of contracting high-grade prostate cancer. (This DOESN"T hold true for younger men though so - good luck!)

I use topical spironolactone. and other wacko concoctions to thwart the effects of androgens and have noticed no decline when stopping finasteride. over 5 months ago. Of course I didn't notice much benefit from finasteride. for the 11 months I was using it anyway.

Let me clarify that statement: I only used finasteride. for about 6 months before adding topical spironolactone. and other "stuff". No benefit from finasteride. for those 6 months, but did see benefits after starting topical spironolactone., etc. So, you have to take my finasteride. "results" with a grain of salt. My results don't mean much. That's the problem with the kitchen sink approach.

I don't have what you would call an "agressive" form of male pattern baldness, so maybe chemicals that diminish the effect of androgens won't help a guy like me all that much? :?

Although, I still do use topical spironolactone. and other wacko stuff touted to neutralize the effect of androgens. I mean, how could I say I use the kitchen sink approach without using stuff that attacks the androgen side of the equation? :lol:

The chemicals I respond the most to are (1) Tempo (2) N-Oxides. Especially Tempo!! Why I respond so well to that stuff is unknown. :hairy: (Before Doctor Proctor gets mad at me, Tempo can be found in all his topicals except the shampoo and conditioner. Well, actually he uses a derivative of Tempo because it's not as stinky and is more stable in solution. But it's basically like "real" Tempo.)

 

[lithebod]

Well I used proctors stuff for about 6 months - I wouldn't categorically say it didnt work but my point is there is just no way of really telling it is or isnt working until of course you notice in 6 months that your hair is looking worse

Im not against the kitchen sink approach if you have the time, money and inclination to do it - what i would caution is for those of us in early stage male pattern baldness (typically aged early to mid 20s) thinking that using all these weird and wonderful treatments is somehow going to be as useful as finasteride (unless you have tried finasteride and got sides/didnt work which is a whole other scenario) - I know as a recent newbie how easy it is to get sold on what is at the end of the day unproven treatment . I still use unproven treatments in my regimen but would only advocate them in tandem with finasteride.

I notice alot of people gravitate to these "natural" treatments so they feel as if they are doing something whilst ignoring that which could be of most benifit - I was once one of those people hence the reason for this post.

 

[Old Baldy]

I understand Lithe. If only there were a cure for this stupid, insidious ailment. :evil:

I mean, what's the point of having hair then later on - you don't have hair? It's stupid to a layman like me. I guess it's all part of the "rusting out" process?

Oh HE**, I don't have any idea what it's all about.

 

[So]

This is some what of a very narrow view on what can possible help towards fighting hair loss.

Vitamins, Minerals, Amino Acids, Fatty Acids, yes can all help your hair, they can even stop your hair loss.

Of course the complexity to which combination of the above is right for anyone individual varies on a case by case basis.

Essential Fatty Acids are good for reducing inflammation. Flaxseed Oil is pretty much useless for a host of reasons I wont get into that will consume this post.

You need Fish Oil & Borage Oil - they may actually help.

You might want to revise your out look, what dont work for you may work for another.

But I get your jist!

 

[87david]

I agree with Lithebod for the most part. I think he’s just advocating the core treatments (finasteride and minoxidil) that have empirical evidence to support their efficacy. Thus, people new to hair loss shouldn’t be misguided by the sheer number of treatments available since many products are just different versions of the same thing. Manufacturers simply add various other ingredients just to differentiate one product from another. However, that being said, various combinations of chemicals in the right proportion might make a big difference in results.

 

[Aplunk1]

I support Lithebod's statement.

I wish I had gotten on the Big 3 earlier.

 

[ang_99]

I think you can bottom line this hair loss stuff pretty easily.

finasteride & minoxidil.....staty on it for a while, if it doesnt work your screwed.

Anything else is just unproven garbage.

Thats all.

 

[Old Baldy]

I think you can bottom line this hair loss stuff pretty easily.

finasteride & minoxidil.....staty on it for a while, if it doesnt work your screwed.

Anything else is just unproven garbage.

Thats all.

Completely disagree. Once again I'm amazed at the "absolute" knowledge some people have of what does or doesn't work. (Doctors and researchers involved in this area of medicine for decades don't have absolute knowledge - but you do!? Ridiculous.)

There are MANY more things you can use besides finasteride. and minoxidil.

For example, have you ever even heard of Tempo, PBN and other SODases, NANO and other n-oxide derivatives, topical spironolactone., dutasteride, nizoral, free fatty acids, retin-a, possibly azelaic acid, various phytochemicals and antioxidants, phenytoin, low laser light, etc.? (All of these things have scientific backing showing they might help us in our fight against male pattern baldness.)

Uh, Aplunk, I notice you use quite a bit more stuff than the "Big 3".

I guess my question to those who limit themselves to only the "Big 3" is WHY? :shock:

 

[ang_99]

[quote="ang_99":d0f23]I think you can bottom line this hair loss stuff pretty easily.

finasteride & minoxidil.....staty on it for a while, if it doesnt work your screwed.

Anything else is just unproven garbage.

Thats all.

Completely disagree. Once again I'm amazed at the "absolute" knowledge some people have of what does or doesn't work. (Doctors and researchers involved in this area of medicine for decades don't have absolute knowledge - but you do!? Ridiculous.)

There are MANY more things you can use besides finasteride. and minoxidil.

For example, have you ever even heard of Tempo, PBN and other SODases, NANO and other n-oxide derivatives, topical spironolactone., dutasteride, nizoral, free fatty acids, retin-a, possibly azelaic acid, various phytochemicals and antioxidants, phenytoin, low laser light, etc.? (All of these things have scientific backing showing they might help us in our fight against male pattern baldness.)

Uh, Aplunk, I notice you use quite a bit more stuff than the "Big 3".

I guess my question to those who limit themselves to only the "Big 3" is WHY? :shock:[/quote:d0f23]

Did I say I had abosolute knowlege? They key word in my statement is ***UNPROVEN****I'm not saying I have "absolute knowlege" BUT there are scientists out there that research this stuff for a living. If they cant say for sure all that crap you mention helps fight hair loss then I'm certainly not gona believe what you or any other joe says. I havent heard of most of that junk because it most likely doesnt work, if it did we would all know about it by now. Nizoral? Nobody can say that helps regrow hair or keep the hair you have, I use it sometimes to help keep a healthy scalp but thats all it does. dutasteride? Not sure thats safe. Lasers..next! Why try to reinvent the wheel, I trust that if something is know to fight hair loss and is safe to use in the long run, whoever has the patent will sell it as such and make a ton of money. Just keepin it real.

 

[westcovinajoe]

Yep, the big 3 work,

Get on Min, finasteride, and nizoral now or just keep going bald.

The choice is yours.

Joe.

 

[Old Baldy]

ang wrote:

Why try to reinvent the wheel

Because (1) male pattern baldness is incurable at this point in time and (2) none of the 3 products you feel are all someone needs to use come close to curing male pattern baldness.

It was good to see you admit you hadn't heard of alot of the stuff I mentioned. I suggest you do some research before you condemn "chemicals" you know nothing about. I jump to conclusions as much as anyone. I'm usually wrong when I do that.

When I started reading about things that could be useful for male pattern baldness, I was shocked at all the stuff that could help (i.e., things that had some scientific testing backing their usage). Don't close your eyes to other stuff just because it isn't mainstream or hasn't been approved by the FDA.

I honestly think you'll be doing yourself a disservice. Do I know I'm correct? No, I can't have that kind of knowledge for something that is incurable.