Trying To Explore The Ptd/dbm Route And Failing

[John Difool]

Okay, so I am trying to jump on the new hair bandwagon because last few months I lost on my temples and as I read somewhere, the darn follicles may still be there waiting to get woken up. PTD/DBM sounds promising although a bit on the cutting edge.

I found a few places in the States selling the compound and valproic acid as a spray but the price is exhorbitant. Some people are making a few bucks on folks like us with hairline issues.

I can't find much about places to get it and I can't even tell how to mix it. Tried my luck on Alibaba but no luck finding the peptide. What is a chemical name that would link to it?

Btw taking VPA orally triggers the opposite result so would have to be topical. But how much daily?

Since I don't know much about it I was curious if someone more hardcore than myself has tried it and what would be their recommendation. Or should I be trying something else?

TIA

 

[HairCook]

"exhorbitant" - actually the peptide is even more expensive. You need to ask for the concentration. Some of the clinics told us 0.001% (rat study used 0.6%). And they called vpa being a seperate "peptide" to buy lmao. Ofc you first have to pay 250 bucks for consulting and join the club. Then you have to pay 200/monthly or so for the peptide.

Besides, they are super shady. If some of these places sells a therapeutical dose I wonder who hunts them down first: a) FDA?, b) choi himself? or c) samumed who went through the entire length of clinical trials to gain proper fda approval for their WNT agonist?

At this point I doubt we will ever see the peptide used for hair loss treatment, we rather need a new inhibitor. Some of the clinics btw refuse to sell the peptide overseas as its too unstable (it needs cooling).

 

[John Difool]

Sad world we live in... Actually the price given was $159 per spray and $25 for a first time dermarolller (can't avoid it even if I said I was using a d2)

Do you think the theory Ptd/Dbm doesn't hold on the promise or that SM is just a simpler alternative? Would you still recommend VPA with any of the Wnt solutions out there?

 

[Photon]

There was a group buy for Choi on a group forum that I was a part of. A few people bought but ultimately a few resold them to me because the dosage needed to be higher and it wouldn't make sense at the price.

Anyway, I used Choi for around four month along with VPA. I didn't notice any difference at all. I was very disappointed because of how expensive it was.

Does it work? I don't know, the science is solid. Maybe they gave me a bad batch, but these were supposed to be "trusted" sellers.

 

[HairCook]

There was a group buy for Choi on a group forum that I was a part of. A few people bought but ultimately a few resold them to me because the dosage needed to be higher and it wouldn't make sense at the price.

Anyway, I used Choi for around four month along with VPA. I didn't notice any difference at all. I was very disappointed because of how expensive it was.

Does it work? I don't know, the science is solid. Maybe they gave me a bad batch, but these were supposed to be "trusted" sellers.

Did it come with a cooling pack? according to those clinics the peptide is very unstable and needs cooling, otherwise it might have been degraded. Besides it has a very high molecular weight, post wounding and otherwise injection might be the only way it works. (everything assuming you had real stuff and not untested alibaba bunk)

Sad world we live in... Actually the price given was $159 per spray and $25 for a first time dermarolller (can't avoid it even if I said I was using a d2)

Do you think the theory Ptd/Dbm doesn't hold on the promise or that SM is just a simpler alternative? Would you still recommend VPA with any of the Wnt solutions out there?

They are different pathways that trigger wnt (and there is more than one wnt pathway), though I did not read how SM opens WNT, CXXC5 is kinda unique as it is a wnt negative feedback loop, hence choi combined it with VPA.


As a sidenote, hyaluronic acid seems to trigger wnt with cd44 interaction. interestingly it mentions wnt3a, the same pathway cxxc5 upregulates. Sadly, hard to test as hyaluronic acid will probably never reach topically the HF without injection due to its ridiculous molecular weight(https://www.docdroid.net/Qs85EaO/liu2016.pdf).

 

[Photon]

Did it come with a cooling pack? according to those clinics the peptide is very unstable and needs cooling, otherwise it might have been degraded. Besides it has a very high molecular weight, post wounding and otherwise injection might be the only way it works. (everything assuming you had real stuff and not untested alibaba bunk)



They are different pathways that trigger wnt (and there is more than one wnt pathway), though I did not read how SM opens WNT, CXXC5 is kinda unique as it is a wnt negative feedback loop, hence choi combined it with VPA.


As a sidenote, hyaluronic acid seems to trigger wnt with cd44 interaction. interestingly it mentions wnt3a, the same pathway cxxc5 upregulates. Sadly, hard to test as hyaluronic acid will probably never reach topically the HF without injection due to its ridiculous molecular weight(https://www.docdroid.net/Qs85EaO/liu2016.pdf).

It came cold but not with ice packs. We talked about the high Dalton but we figured it would be good enough to penetrate if we wounded and also, the peptide has a piece in it specifically designed to penetrate for that very reason - I think it's the DBM part.

 

[John Difool]

I resumed the ptd-dbm treatment I never really started. I use 6mg in 0.1cc BAC daily with scalp injections using a 31g 4mm needle. I use nappage technique with 10 injections around temple and hairline.

I microneedle before then apply VPA 8.3% in distilled water. I prepare batches for 10 days.

 

[whatevr]

There was a group buy for Choi on a group forum that I was a part of. A few people bought but ultimately a few resold them to me because the dosage needed to be higher and it wouldn't make sense at the price.

Anyway, I used Choi for around four month along with VPA. I didn't notice any difference at all. I was very disappointed because of how expensive it was.

Does it work? I don't know, the science is solid. Maybe they gave me a bad batch, but these were supposed to be "trusted" sellers.

Lol, I remember you. The good old days on that Discord eh, we were all hopeful Choi was gonna save us and spent a fuckload of money and waiting on that damn peptide. Wonder where all those people are now, probably lost a lot of hair in those two years, myself included. Nothing ever seems to pan out in the end.

 

[Photon]

Lol, I remember you. The good old days on that Discord eh, we were all hopeful Choi was gonna save us and spent a fuckload of money and waiting on that damn peptide. Wonder where all those people are now, probably lost a lot of hair in those two years, myself included. Nothing ever seems to pan out in the end.

There has never been any good days , but yeah.

 

[John Difool]

Peptide wise I am trying BPC -157 twice daily 250mcg TB-500 twice a week 2.5mg HGH 1mg daily GHK-CU 10mg daily all subq and PTD-DBM .6% scalp injections. Hopefully it helps.

 

[carlos guachiturro]

Valproic acid and its derivatives enhanced estrogenic activity but not androgenic activity in a structure dependent manner. <click for link>

"Co-administration of VPA with DHT reduced AR (Androgen Receptor) activity in a dose-dependent manner."

"Thus, VPA enhanced the E2-induced activation of both ER types in a dose-dependent manner with a slightly greater effect on ER activation"

The studies presumably were using fatty acid Liquid Valproic Acid (VPA), CAS: 99-66-1, rather than Sodium Valproate which has CAS: 1069-66-5. Both confusingly seem to fall under the abbreviation VPA.

The above study highlights that the varying structure of the VPA has differing effects on the relevant receptors, specifically the AR/ER receptors, this could extend to also the GSK3B and WNT/Beta-Catenin pathways (... speculation).

The lack of efficacy in those attempting the Microneedling/VPA route could be due to using Sodium Valproate rather than Valproic Acid.

 

[John Difool]

I use VPA CAS: 99-66-1 8.3%

 

[Penis Head]

What results have you gotten from PTD-DBM? This goes for anybody using it.

Thank you.

 

[rocket_hare]

You can get it here: https://shop.tailormadehealth.com/products/ptd-dbm-methyl-vanillate
And here: https://yuniquemedical.com/shop-with-us/

Don't think it has valporic acid tho.

Seems tailor made health is one compounding and pushing it if you have no other options.
They sell some other stuff to like GHK-CU I think.

I'm trying it atm but only been a few weeks.

 

[KNemo]

the follicles will never wake up and neither should you

I get that you think posting sh*t is "fun" but really... Look at yourself, wasting your life doing nothing. Of course the standard response from people like you is that you're just doing it in between managing a multi-billion dollar business and having fun with an harem of young girls but really...
It's just pathetic.

 

[Penis Head]

Seems tailor made health is one compounding and pushing it if you have no other options.
They sell some other stuff to like GHK-CU I think.

What's your protocol?

What are your results with Tailor-made's PTD so far?

Tailor-made replied to say that their PTD is formulated to not need valproic acid, though did not offer further explanation on that claim.

As for GHK-Cu, I'd like to find a finer microneedle than those of the fat Derma Stamp. New thread on that…

 

[rocket_hare]

What's your protocol?

Pretty standard: minoxidil, RU, oral dutasteride and PTD-DBM, micro-needle every 2-3 weeks.

I've been using PTD-DBM for about 5-6 weeks, not seeing any significant changes, will keep on it for now.

I have not added GHK-Cu, any thoughts on that?
What microneedles are you looking at?

 

[Penis Head]

Pretty standard: minoxidil, RU, oral dutasteride and PTD-DBM, micro-needle every 2-3 weeks.

I've been using PTD-DBM for about 5-6 weeks, not seeing any significant changes, will keep on it for now.

I have not added GHK-Cu, any thoughts on that?
What microneedles are you looking at?

I use Dr Pen. I don't like it because the needle is fat. All the medicine stays on the outside of the dermis. Very little makes it in.

I use capsaicin in minoxidil. It's the best combo I've found. I read some research on capsaicin and then tried it. I got a result. Then I used just minoxidil for about four months. I stopped getting results. After I again added capsaicin to the minoxidil, I got more results. Granted, the seasons change and I do other stuff, too, but it seems to work.

1 Million Scoville Pepper Extract Hot Sauce (I add about 1ml to 60ml bottle of minoxidil).

WARNING: Be very careful with Scoville. Wash thoroughly when done. Any residue on your hands will transfer to any other body part you touch, and this can be very painful for such sensitive places as eyes, nose, or genitals. If the mixture drips into your eye, it will burn. It's dangerous (and that is probably why nobody sells it like this).

I also intradermally inject GHK-cu and TB-500 into my scalp. I wanted to inject Thymulin into my scalp, too, but never tried that.

 

[Penis Head]

Peptide wise I am trying BPC -157 twice daily 250mcg TB-500 twice a week 2.5mg HGH 1mg daily GHK-CU 10mg daily all subq and PTD-DBM .6% scalp injections. Hopefully it helps.

Wow! May I see your progress pics? Do you have a journal? This is something.

Please tell me more about PTD DBM result. How can I get injectable PTD DBM?

What do you think is giving you the most results and why?

Thank you.