Real cause of baldness or a load of rubbish?

KingC

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Found this on another site but apparently the quote is originally from this site.

Ok I was at my GP not too long ago, an Egyptian doctor who I have been seeing for about a decade.

For the first time we spoke about my hair loss, well well fkn well.. what a surprise when that topic was brought up.

Turns out he used to work for Merck & Sharpe as a researcher back in Egypt and he was booted out for his theory on hair loss. This is no bullshit.. this guy was a fkn knowledge machine. All this time!

DHT isn't the cause of hair loss is. Sebum is. This is why:

DHT triggers the glands in your follicle to overproduce sebum. Bacteria gathers in this overflow and your immune system then attacks the bacteria, INCLUDING the hair follicle with inflammation. He said it's very similar to the process of acne.

Propecia works by stopping the DHT triggering the sebum overflow. He said Propecia could make your hair worse if like me hyperandrogenicity causes the extra oil.

He said he proved this theory by putting an early stage patient on low dose accutane. He said the patient regrew hair. He said this is why Retinoid helps, not because it tackles DHT, but because it tackles the sebaceous gland and stops the production of sebum.. hence stopping the gathering of bacteria.. hence no inflammation and no immune response.

I also asked why some medications work and why some don't. He said in theory it should work for all, but there are 2 reasons it doesnt:

1. Internal drugs can cause hyperandrogenicity like I've experienced
2. Topical drugs don't reach the follicle BECAUSE of the sebum build up blocking it. He said minoxidil works best with retin-A not because retin-A helps hair loss through DHT, but helps the minoxidil flow down the follicle wall by eliminating sebum build up.

He said he never really gave it the years of research it deserves, but his theory is ultra-low-doses of Accutane stops hair loss. He said 10mg twice a week will do the job.

He said when he kept trying to push this idea through his experiments, Merck kicked him off the research team.


Now I'm not saying that I agree with the points made but it does provide us with an interesting topic of discussion. I personally do think that sebum plays a part in the hairloss process but probably no where near as much as this person is suggesting. I am quite new to hairloss (I'm 17) so there will be much more educated people than me on the subject of hairloss who can provide their opinion on the matter. I would definetly like to get a reply off of someone who's been on accutane as it shrinks the sebaceous gland and greatly reduces the amount of sebum the body produces (probably more than any other treatment). All opinions are greatly welcomed.
 

KingC

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Found this as well:

Recently, a group of Japanese researcher reported a correlation between excessive sebum in the scalp and hair loss. Excessive sebum often accompanying thinning hair is attributed to an enlargement of the sebaceous gland. They believed excessive sebum causes an high level of 5-alpha reductase and pore clogging, thus malnutrition of the hair root. Although this condition could be hereditary, they believe diet is a more prominent cause. The researchers note that Japanese hair was thick and healthy, with a small gland and little scalp oil, until the occidental habit of consuming animal fat crept into their diet after World War II.


This change has led to a significant height increase in the Japanese population, but it has also resulted in more Japanese men losing hair. To some extent, their observation makes sense since problems with greasy hair have often been noted as much as six months to a year prior to when thinning hair becomes noticeable, but this might be just one of the symptoms, not underlying cause, more research is needed. Most doctors agree that if you have a oily scalp with thinning hair, frequent shampooing is advised. shampooing can reduce surface sebum, which contains high levels of testosterone and DHT that may reenter the skin and affect the hair follicle.
 

Bryan

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KingC said:
DHT isn't the cause of hair loss is. Sebum is. This is why:

Propecia works by stopping the DHT triggering the sebum overflow.

The problem with that theory is that finasteride (the active drug in Propecia) has been shown to have no effect on sebum production. Yes, it's just a load of rubbish.
 

KingC

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After doing some more research it seems reducing sebum in the body seems to at least aggravate hair loss. I've read of alot of people suffering hair loss on accutane but I thought that might be due to other potent ingredients in it but some people who took certain supplements to reduce sebum production reported increasing of hair shedding as well. I'm not going to pretend I know why this is but I think the idea sebum causes hair loss is 100% wrong like bryan just stated before me.
 

abidar

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(prostaglandin D synthasea kind of protein ) would be new cause not DHT i guess so as new research shows lol
 

BritishUser

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Excessive sebum might cause or contribute to hairloss, but it doesn't mean it is responsible for miniaturisation and male pattern baldness.
 

beaner

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Bryan said:
KingC said:
DHT isn't the cause of hair loss is. Sebum is. This is why:

Propecia works by stopping the DHT triggering the sebum overflow.

The problem with that theory is that finasteride (the active drug in Propecia) has been shown to have no effect on sebum production. Yes, it's just a load of rubbish.

I'm not doubting that what you're saying is true, but why do you suppose that my hair/scalp/forehead no longer gets greasy since starting finasteride? I used to have to wash it daily and now I don't---and I'm definitely not imagining this. I noticed this also when I used high doses of saw palmetto many years ago.
 

Bryan

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beaner said:
I'm not doubting that what you're saying is true, but why do you suppose that my hair/scalp/forehead no longer gets greasy since starting finasteride? I used to have to wash it daily and now I don't---and I'm definitely not imagining this...

I have no idea why that is. The people who did the testing had their subjects take Proscar tablets (a full 5 mg), and their testing used Sebutape test strips (which have been used to measure sebum by dermatologists in LOTS of different experiments). That method is sound. I have no idea why you had the effect you claim.
 

kc444

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It sounds like he was fired from Merck for his incompetence. Accutane causes hair loss. It also reduces sebum production permanently, so you'd expect people to never lose hair if they've taken it. Propecia doesn't ever make male pattern baldness worse unless you count temporary shedding.

I took Accutane when i was 16 and have had very aggressive hair loss since I was 16-17.
 

BaldingHelpMe

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He said he never really gave it the years of research it deserves, but his theory is ultra-low-doses of Accutane stops hair loss. He said 10mg twice a week will do the job.

The key word here is "ultra-low doses". Has anyone tried? Or are there any way to reduce sebum or oily face and scalp?
 

BaldingHelpMe

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I have no idea why that is. The people who did the testing had their subjects take Proscar tablets (a full 5 mg), and their testing used Sebutape test strips (which have been used to measure sebum by dermatologists in LOTS of different experiments). That method is sound. I have no idea why you had the effect you claim.

So is it proven that dutasteride/finasteride increases sebum production?
 

chusler

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Inhibition of Sebum Production with the Acetyl Coenzyme A Carboxylase Inhibitor Olumacostat Glasaretil

Link-1: http://www.jidonline.org/article/S0022-202X(17)30186-0/fulltext

Olumacostat Glasaretil, a Promising Topical Sebum-Suppressing Agent that Affects All Major Pathogenic Factors of Acne Vulgaris

Link-2: http://www.jidonline.org/article/S0022-202X(17)30171-9/fulltext

its a new drug (TOPICAL)- Olumacostat Glasaretil (DRM01)- phase 3 will be completed in first half of 2018

Link-3: https://dermira.com/pipeline/olumacostat-glasaretil/

"Specifically targeting excessive sebum production.
Olumacostat glasaretil is thought to have a differentiated mechanism of action. It is designed to exert its effect by inhibiting acetyl coenzyme-A carboxylase, an enzyme that plays an important role in the synthesis of more than 80 percent of the lipids that make up sebum.

Topline results from a Phase 2b dose-ranging clinical trial in adult patients 18 and older with moderate-to-severe facial acne vulgaris have been reported."

"If approved, olumacostat glasaretil would be the first topical treatment for acne to specifically target excessive sebum production"
 
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resu

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Inhibition of Sebum Production with the Acetyl Coenzyme A Carboxylase Inhibitor Olumacostat Glasaretil

Link: http://www.jidonline.org/article/S0022-202X(17)30186-0/fulltext

its a new drug (TOPICAL)- Olumacostat Glasaretil (DRM01)- phase 3 will be completed in first half of 2018

Link: https://dermira.com/pipeline/olumacostat-glasaretil/

"Specifically targeting excessive sebum production.
Olumacostat glasaretil is thought to have a differentiated mechanism of action. It is designed to exert its effect by inhibiting acetyl coenzyme-A carboxylase, an enzyme that plays an important role in the synthesis of more than 80 percent of the lipids that make up sebum.

Topline results from a Phase 2b dose-ranging clinical trial in adult patients 18 and older with moderate-to-severe facial acne vulgaris have been reported."

"If approved, olumacostat glasaretil would be the first topical treatment for acne to specifically target excessive sebum production"

So much for Winlevi, Cosmo am cry. I hope they're successful, I need their DRM01 drug.
 
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