Minoxidil, only 40% success rate?

[Guest]

I have been reading through other forums, and some of which have responses from physicians. Many of the users and the doctors posting on these forums keep stating minoxidil only has about a 40% success rate, this seems rather low. Does anyone know if this is an accurate representation?

I am currently on Propecia (7th month) and added minoxidil 5% to routine to increase chance of some regrowth on the crown/vertex of my head. Many forum users say get on propecia to keep what you have + regrow some possibly, but if your mostly after regrowth to go ahead and add minoxidil.

 

[wooz]

i know it's on the rogaine site but still, it says ...

In clinical testing, ROGAINE® Foam regrew hair in 85% of men after 4 months when used twice daily.

that's quite a bit better than 40%.

maybe the new foam is that much better?
hopefully so, i just started using it about a month ago.

good luck

 

[Bryan]

I have been reading through other forums, and some of which have responses from physicians. Many of the users and the doctors posting on these forums keep stating minoxidil only has about a 40% success rate, this seems rather low. Does anyone know if this is an accurate representation?

It obviously depends on how they're defining a "success", and I'm not sure how they're doing it. Is it an improvement in haircounts after using minoxidil? Is it an ability to see an improvement in hair in photographs, before-and-after using minoxidil? Without knowing that small but important detail, it's impossible to verify or deny that claim.

 

[Guest]

@ Byran, good points I am not sure how they are defining success. At any rate, what would be an accurate percentage for regrowth with minoxidil? Also I read a report stating the liquid was more potent than the foam, is this true?

 

[adolobe]

You will see conflicting reports that say foam is better than liquid and vice versa.

Foam is best for guy who are sensitive to PPG and have short hair. The PPG is what makes some guys scalp flaky and itch.

If you can handle PPG and have medium to long hair liquid is the way to go. But dont buy the cheap liquids are they are super greasy from high concentrations of PPG. Go with Dr. Lee's less PPG more Alcohol and drys clean and in min's.

Which ever way you decide to go Min has been proven tie and time again that it works. Keep in mind if you applying it to an area with folical shrinkage that is several years old and completely stoped growing noticible hairs. Min could take a very long time to work. As the hair folicals have to cycle several times to become thicker. A slick bald scalp area the folicals are so thin you can barely see them. They are not dead so they will eventually show some growth but it could take long then expected.

 

[Guest]

@ Adolobe

I am using http://www.amazon.com/Minoxidil-5-E...sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=beauty&qid=1274114710&sr=8-1 currently, the kirkland 5% minoxidil. If thats inferior, perhaps I should switch.

Also here is a picture of what I am working with, medium hair I would say so I should probably stick with the liquid.

 

[Bryan]

Min could take a very long time to work. As the hair folicals have to cycle several times to become thicker.

I don't know that to be true. In fact, a well-known expert (Dr. David Whiting, author of numerous articles and studies) published an article in a medical journal arguing that it specifically is NOT true. Hair follicles can make relatively sudden, abrupt changes within the space of a SINGLE cycle.

 

[Bryan]

Also I read a report stating the liquid was more potent than the foam, is this true?

I don't know. I've never seen a study comparing the two.

 

[adolobe]

Bryan Ive not read that study. Can you possible provide me a link as I would be interested in giving it a thorough reading.

 

[adolobe]

@ Adolobe

I am using http://www.amazon.com/Minoxidil-5-E...sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=beauty&qid=1274114710&sr=8-1 currently, the kirkland 5% minoxidil. If thats inferior, perhaps I should switch.

Also here is a picture of what I am working with, medium hair I would say so I should probably stick with the liquid.

Kirklands Minoxidil is highly regarded by many members of he Hairloss community. I personally dislike it for its greasy application, long drying time, plus the higher concentration of PPG makes my scalp itch constantly and causes a good deal of flaking when I tried it out.

Thats why I switched to Dr Lee's as it drys in under 5 mins, and causes no itching or flaking. Plus cosmetically I can apply it in the am and no one can even tell its there Though its not as cheap as Kirklands but you get what you pay for

If your not exp any difficulties with Kirkaland then your fine as its the same stuff as the Rogain liquid. If your only thinning in the crown based of that photo I could say Foam would also work for you. Foam is more a difficulty for diffused thinners as they lose most of it on the hair.

 

[ddongkko21]

just switched to minoxidil 10% and i'm losing ground. i just took off my hat, and my frontal hair is all curled up and super thin, unline the rest of the head. it looks like someone just threw up on my forehead.

just out of curiocity, Brian, I see you on alot of thread passing down your knowledge in hairloss and treatment and i think that's really cool but.. who are you really? i mean, i don't see your story or hairloss situation anywhee yet, you're everywehre. are you a moderator? a doctor perhaps a nurse? or are you just an ordinary next door bald man w hairy chest?

 

[Bryan]

Bryan Ive not read that study. Can you possible provide me a link as I would be interested in giving it a thorough reading.

I have no idea if it's available online. However, if you have access to a medical library, here's the abstract:

J Am Acad Dermatol. 2001 Sep;45(3 Suppl):S81-6.

"Possible mechanisms of miniaturization during androgenetic alopecia or pattern hair loss." Whiting DA.

Baylor Hair Research and Treatment Center, Dallas, TX 75246, USA.

Abstract
In androgenetic alopecia, or pattern hair loss, follicles undergo miniaturization, shrinking from terminal to vellus-like hairs. Traditionally, this process is thought to progress gradually over a number of follicular cycles. However, it is unlikely that miniaturization can be explained only by a series of progressively shorter anagen cycles. Simple calculations show that this process would take too long for significant miniaturization to occur secondary to shorter anagen cycles alone, especially in view of the latent lag period seen in pattern hair loss that occurs between the loss of a telogen hair and the appearance of an anagen hair. Evidence is presented to support a new concept that miniaturization is an abrupt, large-step process that also can be reversed in 1 hair cycle, as has been shown clinically, with confirmatory histologic evidence, in patients with pattern hair loss responding to finasteride treatment. It is hypothesized that the miniaturization seen with pattern hair loss may be the direct result of reduction in the cell number and, hence, size of the dermal papilla.

 

[Bryan]

just out of curiocity, Brian, I see you on alot of thread passing down your knowledge in hairloss and treatment and i think that's really cool but.. who are you really? i mean, i don't see your story or hairloss situation anywhee yet, you're everywehre. are you a moderator? a doctor perhaps a nurse? or are you just an ordinary next door bald man w hairy chest?

I've discussed my personal situation numerous times over the years, enough to where I don't feel any strong need to keep going over it. I'm not a moderator, doctor, or nurse; I'm just an ordinary next door balding man w hairy chest!

 

[Mr. P]

I use Kirkland liquid and have somewhat shaggy hair (about three inches on top). I haven't found the liquid to be that greasy nor slow to dry. Then again, that may be a result of my longer hair. I could see how the liquid may get runny if your hair was short/buzzed.

 

[adolobe]

Bryan Ive not read that study. Can you possible provide me a link as I would be interested in giving it a thorough reading.

I have no idea if it's available online. However, if you have access to a medical library, here's the abstract:

J Am Acad Dermatol. 2001 Sep;45(3 Suppl):S81-6.

"Possible mechanisms of miniaturization during androgenetic alopecia or pattern hair loss." Whiting DA.

Baylor Hair Research and Treatment Center, Dallas, TX 75246, USA.

Abstract
In androgenetic alopecia, or pattern hair loss, follicles undergo miniaturization, shrinking from terminal to vellus-like hairs. Traditionally, this process is thought to progress gradually over a number of follicular cycles. However, it is unlikely that miniaturization can be explained only by a series of progressively shorter anagen cycles. Simple calculations show that this process would take too long for significant miniaturization to occur secondary to shorter anagen cycles alone, especially in view of the latent lag period seen in pattern hair loss that occurs between the loss of a telogen hair and the appearance of an anagen hair. Evidence is presented to support a new concept that miniaturization is an abrupt, large-step process that also can be reversed in 1 hair cycle, as has been shown clinically, with confirmatory histologic evidence, in patients with pattern hair loss responding to finasteride treatment. It is hypothesized that the miniaturization seen with pattern hair loss may be the direct result of reduction in the cell number and, hence, size of the dermal papilla.

Thanks Bryan

I'll try to look this up on Monday

 

[blaze]

It states that miniaturization *can* be reversed in one step.

That doesnt mean that it *always* does, but rather can in some cases.

From looking at pics of people who respond well to treatments they all have shown a gradual thickening. I have often read people saying they grew somewhat fine hair, then it fell out. But then it grew back in even stronger on the next hair cycle.

You can even see it on the photos they use to document their success.

So maybe hair can grow back terminal in one cycle, but from the photographic evidence I have seen on sites like this its just not the norm. Its usually a process of a few hair cycles.

 

[Bryan]

From looking at pics of people who respond well to treatments they all have shown a gradual thickening.

Sure. Gradual thickening in the same cycle.

I have often read people saying they grew somewhat fine hair, then it fell out. But then it grew back in even stronger on the next hair cycle.

You can even see it on the photos they use to document their success.

How on earth would you be able to document that in photos?

So maybe hair can grow back terminal in one cycle, but from the photographic evidence I have seen on sites like this its just not the norm. Its usually a process of a few hair cycles.

Nah. I think that's just a weird Urban Myth that got started on hairloss forums. I can't think of any a priori reason why that would be the case, and I think Whiting makes a good case against it.