male pattern baldness Being Caused By Environmental Factors?

[abcdefg]

I was just reading this from hair loss blog, and wondered how much do things like smoking, air pollution, diet, and environmental factors play into male pattern baldness? If they play a large role why is finasteride and dutasteride so amazingly effective at stopping male pattern baldness when all those same environmental factors are all at play? The twin study seemed to support that.

http://jddonline.com/articles/dermatology/S1545961617S0135X

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

I was just reading this from hair loss blog, and wondered how much do things like smoking, air pollution, diet, and environmental factors play into male pattern baldness? If they play a large role why is finasteride and dutasteride so amazingly effective at stopping male pattern baldness when all those same environmental factors are all at play? The twin study seemed to support that.

http://jddonline.com/articles/dermatology/S1545961617S0135X

1) Whether or not you take finasteride is an environmental factor.
2) hormone levels, hormone sensitivity, etc are well known to be functions of environment.
3) Nearly everything is a product of both genes and environment.
4) Hair loss is poorly researched so you won't find the answers you're looking for.

 

[abcdefg]

1) Whether or not you take finasteride is an environmental factor.
2) hormone levels, hormone sensitivity, etc are well known to be functions of environment.
3) Nearly everything is a product of both genes and environment.
4) Hair loss is poorly researched so you won't find the answers you're looking for.

I am just saying most men going bald are on no treatments at first. They are losing hair from environmental factors. None of this changes, and they add finasteride. The facts for finasteride speak for themselves in 85 percent of men their hair loss significantly slows or stops despite all those same environmental factors as they originally had. Which to me suggests environmental factors are a minor one kind of contradictory to the twin study.
I still question to what degree hormone levels/sensitivity are affected by environment, and what ratio for male pattern baldness its genetics vs environment factors. I guess its pointless because ill probably be dead before we have answers to this with how slow we figure things out
I think there is a lot of real world evidence that suggests male pattern baldness is not caused by envirnmental factors very much. Why do women not go bald but men do? I dont see very many thinning women despite these same factors. I think its all hormones, and the resulting pathways farther down which might be influenced slightly by environment.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

I am just saying most men going bald are on no treatments at first. They are losing hair from environmental factors. None of this changes, and they add finasteride. The facts for finasteride speak for themselves in 85 percent of men their hair loss significantly slows or stops despite all those same environmental factors as they originally had. Which to me suggests environmental factors are a minor one kind of contradictory to the twin study.
I still question to what degree hormone levels/sensitivity are affected by environment, and what ratio for male pattern baldness its genetics vs environment factors. I guess its pointless because ill probably be dead before we have answers to this with how slow we figure things out
I think there is a lot of real world evidence that suggests male pattern baldness is not caused by envirnmental factors very much. Why do women not go bald but men do? I dont see very many thinning women despite these same factors. I think its all hormones, and the resulting pathways farther down which might be influenced slightly by environment.

A lot of women go bald, it's very common, they just have a different pattern so it gets masked. Women's hair thins out, whereas men typically have receding hairlines and desertification of the crown. The pattern is different, but the total loss of hair is not that different.

As for hormones and environment, as an example it's known and documented that the sperm counts of men are down by roughly one half since scientists have started keeping track. Also, girls are hitting puberty at an earlier age, people are heavier, living longer, dying of different diseases, etc. It's clearly the case that environment affects hormones / hormone receptors, though I can't tell you in which combination.

 

[BaldyBalderBald]

A lot of women go bald, it's very common, they just have a different pattern so it gets masked. Women's hair thins out, whereas men typically have receding hairlines and desertification of the crown. The pattern is different, but the total loss of hair is not that different.

As for hormones and environment, as an example it's known and documented that the sperm counts of men are down by roughly one half since scientists have started keeping track. Also, girls are hitting puberty at an earlier age, people are heavier, living longer, dying of different diseases, etc. It's clearly the case that environment affects hormones / hormone receptors, though I can't tell you in which combination.

So many possible factors, cattle raised with hormones, old and unused meds thrown away and they discovered tracks of them in potable water, pollution, genetic mutation...i don't think we'll ever get an answer to that, but i agree, there is something

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

So many possible factors, cattle raised with hormones, old and unused meds thrown away and they discovered tracks of them in potable water, pollution, genetic mutation...i don't think we'll ever get an answer to that, but i agree, there is something

Yes I agree.

male pattern baldness is almost certainly largely environmental. However, that doesn't mean that we're going to figure out the inputs soon, nor does it mean that the inputs are obvious (e.g. eat vegan, get a lot of sleep).

 

[countjulian]

Yes I agree.

male pattern baldness is almost certainly largely environmental. However, that doesn't mean that we're going to figure out the inputs soon, nor does it mean that the inputs are obvious (e.g. eat vegan, get a lot of sleep).

People have been going bald since we have records of people, I don't understand how it could be environmental. If it's environmental it must be a factor that's been in the environment since ancient Egypt and Sumeria.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

People have been going bald since we have records of people, I don't understand how it could be environmental. If it's environmental it must be a factor that's been in the environment since ancient Egypt and Sumeria.

There's been an environment since we had records of people lol, and before.

A good example is sperm counts, mentioned above. Men have always had a non-zero sperm count, we know that since we're here. But we also know that on average, it's declined by one half in recent decades.

Another example is height. People have always had a non-zero height. But it's clearly a function of culture, embryonic and early childhood nutrition, as well as genetics. Average height has risen several inches this century. But it's risen more in the Netherlands than in the USA, where it's actually been flat or falling since the late 1970s.

Obesity is known to have genetic precursors. Biological parents are a better predictor of obesity than adoptive parents. Yet body mass index began skyrocketing in 1977. Did our genetics change in 1977?

Lastly, there's a huge difference between going bald at thirty and at fifty. The twins study showed that baldness rates vary from twin to twin.

Virtually all processes involve a complex interaction of genes and environment.

 

[countjulian]

There's been an environment since we had records of people lol, and before.

A good example is sperm counts, mentioned above. Men have always had a non-zero sperm count, we know that since we're here. But we also know that on average, it's declined by one half in recent decades.

Another example is height. People have always had a non-zero height. But it's clearly a function of culture, embryonic and early childhood nutrition, as well as genetics. Average height has risen several inches this century. But it's risen more in the Netherlands than in the USA, where it's actually been flat or falling since the late 1970s.

Obesity is known to have genetic precursors. Biological parents are a better predictor of obesity than adoptive parents. Yet body mass index began skyrocketing in 1977. Did our genetics change in 1977?

Lastly, there's a huge difference between going bald at thirty and at fifty. The twins study showed that baldness rates vary from twin to twin.

Virtually all processes involve a complex interaction of genes and environment.

There's no difference I know of in baldness rates now and in the past.

 

[BaldyBalderBald]

There's clearly a difference amoung population tho.

It seems that it's our fault Eurobrahs
Mainly European former colonies are doomed to 50+%

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

There's no difference I know of in baldness rates now and in the past.

Obviously -- nobody has looked into it.

 

[Raphael13]

Anything that can strip your hair from vitamins and blood flow is of course bad, like smoking. Then there are people that smoked for over 30 years and are still a norwood 1-2. It's hard to tell really.

 

[InBeforeTheCure]

From a recent study:

We have observed an h2SNP of 94%, which suggests that MBP is more a polygenic trait than a complex one, with very little environmental component. This estimate is in accordance with previous studies which have estimated dichotomised MBP heritability to be 89% for clear-cut vertex balding and 96% for recessive balding34. Two recent papers9,33have estimated h2SNP to be significantly lower (0.48 and 0.52), however we must consider that in the first case a different method of converting the explained phenotypic variance from the observed scale to the liability one was used instead of the one implemented in GCTA while in the other rather dubious baldness cases were included (group 2 on the scale used in the UKB study), which may explain the difference.

 

[N003]

There's clearly a difference amoung population tho.

View attachment 70389

It seems that it's our fault Eurobrahs
Mainly European former colonies are doomed to 50+%

FAKE MAP

I would say that at most 20-30% of all men go bald.

 

[BaldyBalderBald]

FAKE MAP

I would say that at most 20-30% of all men go bald.

Hard to say, Norwood is not mentionned, it can be some slight recession to a full horseshoe pattern, age is not mentionned neither, and in France, from what i've seen myself, 60%+ is accurate

 

[michel sapin]

france crew checking in with male pattern baldness over 60 %

 

[michel sapin]

instead in my college where everybody is Norwood -1

 

[BaldyBalderBald]

instead in my college where everybody is Norwood -1

Feels bald man
In my highschool we were not that much, but in faculty i felt a little more 'normal' with more baldlites around