Help! Should I have my levels checked first?

[Guest]

I actually STARTED to take my Finax already but have only taken two doses so far (yesterday, and the first on Wed.) and was able to even cut the pill into 1/8ths so they have only been 0.125mg. I was planning on going up to 0.25mg after two weeks and then simply stay on this low dosage regimen.

I'm curious though, because I'm a diffuse thinner in a somewhat patchy pattern (it's all on the TOP of my head, but is somewhat patchy/strippy and does not follow the typical progression of male pattern baldness) I'm curious if I should just stop taking the Finax and have my thyroid and hormone levels checked out first?

My father is also in his 60's and has a full head of hair (always had a big forehead, so he may have slightly receded). I think his dad had male pattern baldness but I do not know to what extent as he died before I was born. My grandfather on my mom's side also always had a full head of hair. I just wrote it off as getting my grandfather's (on my dad's side) male pattern baldness gene.

I read something the other night that diffuse thinning in general could suggest something hormonal related for this, and then the fact that my thinning is also patchy, and kind in strips, also expanded on this theory and thought maybe I should wait and get checked up first?

Has anybody HAD this type of diffuse thinning and it simply was related to male pattern baldness? I'm also a little nervous about telling my doctor that I'm taking Finax ordered from an online pharmacy.

Would appreciate any suggestions.

 

[Guest]

Dude, you don´t need to tell your doctor that you are on Finax. My advice would be to make sure that you actually have male pattern baldness asap. I can´t understand that you are waiting so long.

 

[Guest]

finax certainly affects hormone levels so you should tell him that you're on it if he's testing those, lol.

i think you still probably have male pattern baldness. I have the patchy thinning as well on the top of the head. Unless you have considerable side and back thinning as well then chances are you just have DPA(diffuse patterned alopecia), which is treated the exact same way as male pattern baldness. I have DPA and judging by your description you have it too.

 

[Guest]

Thanks for the response guys.

Taug, I'm still relatively young and do not go the doctor unless I have to. My thinning has gotten worse the last couple of years too and I really didn't start ANY treatments until almost a year ago when it was just by using thickening shampoos and adding in some Saw Palmetto.

I also thought as Jayman did that if my DHT levels were going to be tested then I SHOULD tell him. However, as I mentioned, since I've so far only taken two dosages of 0.125mg finax then I could probably just stop it until I can get in to see the doctor and my levels should be back to normal by then if they were even effected by these two 0.125mg doses I've taken this week.

No I'm not having any thinning on the sides or back, so that's another reason why I was thinking that it probably was just some form of male pattern baldness rather than thyroid or something like that. I have never heard of "diffuse patterned alopecia" though. I guess if it's treated the same way as androgenic alopecia then I'm on the right track.

Before Farrel banned me from HLH there was some wacky lady on there saying how Singulair is supposed to contribute to hairloss. Now the topic was pretty far out in left field and involved a test at her local doctors office w/a sample size of like 6 people. Sounded conspiracy theorist but I DID wonder before if this could cause hair loss. I cannot find this as a listed side effect for this medication though.

So if its likely DPA then should I just continue with the Finax regimen and tell the doctor when I see him or cut it off now and wait until I can get in there? The worst the doctor can say is that he doesn't recommend ordering medications overseas from an online pharmacy right? Though finasteride is not a controlled substance and I thought legislation was passed last year allow the importation of non-controlled drugs for no larger than a 90 day supply?

 

[Guest]

DPA is male pattern baldness, sorry for the confusion. The PATTERN is diffuse rather than the typical male pattern baldness pattern though.

Just continue it. You can't afford to lose hair. The doctor will not report you to any agencies for buying it overseas haha. Plenty of seniors buy their drugs from online pharmacies as well to save money.

 

[Guest]

I couldn't find anything about DPA but I was able to find DUPA (Diffuse unpatterned Alopecia). There's a few articles about it at baldingblog.com and it sounds like the same treatments apply as you said but also the sides can diffuse with somebody who has DUPA.

I guess I'll just stick with the Finax than and begrudgingly tell the doctor (whomever that may be, still gotta pick one!). I'm pretty sure I recall that legislation passing allowing imported non-controlled drugs otherwise I would be concerned about what you said. I don't trust anybody right off the bat.

Thanks again for the suggestions and responses. One last call for dissenters however in case there's another thought on this?

Oh and are there any specific hormones I should request to be tested? Again, because of my distrust for people in general, and doctors in specific, I wouldn't be so sure they'd even know what hormones to check in regards to DPA, DUPA, male pattern baldness, etc.

 

[Guest]

bump.

 

[Guest]

i'd bet some cash that your doctor won't even know what DPA or DUPA is. most people on here don't.

here's a good link from dr bernstein:

http://www.bernsteinmedical.com/hair-lo ... cation.php

"Two other types of genetic hair loss in men not often considered by doctors, “Diffuse Patterned Alopeciaâ€￾ and “Diffuse Unpatterned Alopecia,â€￾ pose a significant challenge both in diagnosis and in patient management. Understanding these conditions is crucial to the evaluation of hair loss in both men and women, particularly those that are young when the diagnoses may be easily missed, as they may indicate that a patient is not a candidate for surgery. (Bernstein and Rassman “Follicular Transplantation: Patient Evaluation and Surgical Planningâ€￾)

Diffuse Patterned Alopecia (DPA) is an androgenetic alopecia manifested as diffuse thinning in the front, top and crown, with a stable permanent zone. In DPA, the entire top of the scalp gradually miniaturizes (thins) without passing through the typical Norwood stages. Diffuse Unpatterned Alopecia (DUPA) is also androgenetic, but lacks a stable permanent zone and affects men much less often than DPA. DUPA tends to advance faster than DPA and end up in a horseshoe pattern resembling the Norwood class VII. However, unlike the Norwood VII, the DUPA horseshoe can look almost transparent due to the low density of the back and sides. Differentiating between DPA and DUPA is very important because DPA patients often make good transplant candidates, whereas DUPA patients almost never do, as they eventually have extensive hair loss without a stable zone for harvesting."

If your sides are thick like you say they are, I'm guessing you just have DPA which is transplantable. You end up at your final Norwood like everyone else with regular male pattern baldness, assuming no drug intervention, you just take a messy way of getting there because your whole top gets gradually thinner rather than receding.

here's another good paper to read if you want that mentions DUPA and DPA. just use the find feature in your browser to search for those words in the document:

http://www.newhair.com/resources/mp-1997-evaluation.asp

 

[Guest]

Important paragraphs from the second link:

"The diffuse androgenetic alopecias, that we will refer to simply as DA and which consist of Diffuse Patterned Alopecia (DPA) and Diffuse Unpatterned Alopecia (DUPA), can be further divided into various stages of progression with DA 0 representing the pre-balding state. The earliest stage of loss, in these diffuse alopecias, DA 1 , would be characterized clinically by a "slightly thinning" look in the front, top, and vertex, best visualized under strong lights or when the hair is wet. At other times it might not be noticeable. Almost all patients have subjective complaints of less fullness in the affected areas. Preliminary densitometry studies in the thinning area of these patients have revealed miniaturization to be in the range of 20-50%. DA 2 represents the stage when there is obvious thinning evident under normal lighting, but if the hair is styled properly, the degree of hair loss may be acceptable. Miniaturization for DA 2 is on the order of 50-75%. Patients with DA 3 have significant hair loss in the transplanted area, and the coverage it provides is no longer adequate. The frontal hairline, though still recognizable in it's position as the mature hairline, does not have enough density to frame the face. Miniaturization in DA 3 is usually around 75-95%. The DA 4 patient has lost most of his terminal hair in the balding area (miniaturization > 95%), generally has involvement of the crown, and is similar in appearance to the typical Norwood Class VII."

The DA scale is a substitute for the Norwood scale. For example, I would say that I was a DA-2 pre-treatment, and now I am a DA-1. But unlike the Norwood scale, a 1 on the DA scale is not a full head of hair. That would be a DA-0 with no balding showing. That's why I say I'm a DA-1, because except when my hair is wet or under very bright lighting, I show no real loss.

 

[Guest]

Thanks again for the help man, appreciate it. I skimmed over this info at the moment but will read it in more depth later, and looks like I have some more research to do now on DPA and DUPA.

I liked that comment in your first post that sufferers of DPA make good transplant candidates. I guess because it's only small sections at a time that have to be filled in rather than a whole area that has no hair?

So at this point it sounds like DPA is better to have than DUPA?

 

[Guest]

Thanks again for the help man, appreciate it. I skimmed over this info at the moment but will read it in more depth later, and looks like I have some more research to do now on DPA and DUPA.

I liked that comment in your first post that sufferers of DPA make good transplant candidates. I guess because it's only small sections at a time that have to be filled in rather than a whole area that has no hair?

So at this point it sounds like DPA is better to have than DUPA?

No that's not the reason why. The reason is that the DPA end result is the same as the Norwood end result. Sufferers of both retain a permanent zone around the sides and back of their head. They just take different routes to get there as i said. Norwoods recede and the crown thins until they meet each other in the horseshoe pattern. DPA people just thin all over the front and crown until it goes away. See what im saying? Norwood is steady movement with the hairline moving back and the crown moving forward until they meet. DPA is with that whole non-permanent region thinning all at once. But BOTH DPA and Norwood retain the permanent donor zone of hair around the sides and back.

DUPA, on the other hand, has no permanent zone. The hair around the sides and back(the DONOR area) thins as well, leaving them with almost a transparent horseshoe. So yes DPA is infinitely better to have because you can almost NEVER transplant a DUPA patient because their side/back hair isn't permanent. If you take grafts from them and put them up front they may very well miniaturize in a few years and theyll look like idiots. Why bother?

You understand now?

 

[Guest]

Well my doctor didn't know much more than the basics about hair loss, apparently she knew that a lot of derms don't either. She said she's referred some people to them about male pattern baldness and they will just tell them go to on Rogaine. She suggested just to use that and propecia.

I told her that I was using a generic version of propecia called "Finax" and she acknowledged but then I guess was curious how I got it and asked if it was OTC. I told her no that I bought it from an online pharmacy and her reaction was priceless. "OH MY GAAAAAWWWWWWD!!" as she looked over towards my wife with a shocked smile about it. lol. I just said that I researched these pharmacies and the meds extensively before I made the choice to take the small risk. She didn't seem to mind as she later on stated that insurance wouldn't cover propecia anyways so to just stay on the finax. I told her that some people use proscar and cut it up (to see what she'd say) and she just acknowledged and said it was prescribed for BPH. I don't want proscar anyways because I wouldn't be able to get it down to a 0.25mg dosage.

I think the only hormone she was going to check, to see if it wasn't male pattern baldness related, was thyroid levels. I told her how my dad has a full head of hair in his 60's and my grandfather on my mom's side had a full head too (I think my grandfather on my dad's side lost hair though, not sure to what extent) but she said I could just be the unlucky one. How many generations could a male pattern baldness gene lay dormant for?

To note, she is a very good doctor overall but not half as good with male pattern baldness knowledge as most people here. Just saying as it seems some people here will judge the doctor based on their knowledge/experience with this one specific issue.

Will post thyroid results when I get them next week. Probably will be normal though and I'm just the "unlucky one" as my Doctor said.

 

[Guest]

Well, my thyroid level was fine. Oh well, guess I'm just stuck with DPA or DUPA and have to keep doing what I'm doing to treat it.

I was hoping maybe it would become a magic thyroid pill that would certainly bring all my hair back rather than all the topicals and finasteride.

Why was only my thyroid checked though? Aren't there other conditions that can lead to hair loss where other hormones should be checked out as well?