WHAT ANTIANDROGEN DO YOU THINK TAKES THE CAKE?

[Empire]

Please only vote for the selection that has either
A. Worked for you
B. Provided so much study and research (that you've thoroughly) read to put you beyond reasonable doubt would be the best.

After voting, please leave your explanation to why you voted your option.

 

[Odie]

finasteride - worked for me. Spent loads of time researching before going for it , and glad I did

 

[diffuse propecia]

The cake is a lie, just sayin.

 

[decro435]

This doesn't really make sense since 90% of the people use finasteride, therefore finasteride will have the most votes...

 

[Nuli]

Very effective/high risk of sides/expensive: dutasteride
Very effective/no risk of sides/Availability issues: RU
Effective/moderate risk of sides/very cheap: finasteride

IMO finasteride takes the cake if you factor all issues of the others.

 

[Empire]

This doesn't really make sense since 90% of the people use finasteride, therefore finasteride will have the most votes...

Not really, it's a close one atm.

 

[amsch]

Very effective/no risk of sides/Availability issues: RU

That isn't so sure.

 

[decro435]

Very effective/no risk of sides/Availability issues: RU

That isn't so sure.

True, there aren't enough studies to prove there aren't any side effects. I was told that spironolactone wouldn't produce any side effects, unfortuenatly I had a rapid heart beat and trouble breathing after only apply a 5% lotion topically once a night. While It might be 1 in 50 that gets these, they're still there.

The conclusion of the side effects due to Finasteride is divided. I believe that 2% is way below the actual percentage, which I would expect to be up at about 30%.

Hearing a treatment being free of side effects is very attractive to the consumer. Unfortuenatly I believe most treatments will produce side effects, just at different levels..

 

[JWM]

*waiting for Bryan to come on and state that finasteride and dutasteride are not antiandrogens*

 

[Jack]

*waiting for Bryan to come on and state that finasteride and dutasteride are not antiandrogens*

Well, at least finasteride and dutasteride work completely different than the other drugs in this poll.
But you could argue that they could be classified as anti-androgens as well , it's just a naming issue

 

[pproctor]

Topical-- spironolactone. Oral, finasteride.

On paper at least, spironolactone should be considerably more potent than finasteride. This is not our experience-- they seem to be about the same. We use it because it is not absorbed systematically to any significant extent and thus has minimal side-effects.

In my experience, looking for the "best" antiandrogen may be lost effort anyway. Reason is that there seems to be a barrier beyond which more antiandrogenic activity does not produce additional results.

For example, even castrated prostate cancer patients receiving high-dose flutamide don't reverse balding much. These people are about as antiandrogenized as you can get.

A complex set of factors likely accounts for this "barrier". Reflex hyperandrogenicity, comprised mostly of increased testosterone levels and increased tissue androgen sensitivity is just one of these.

One reason finasteride works better than it should is likely that its relative tissue specficity means that it does not elicit such strong reflex hyperandrogenicity.

Peter H. Proctor, PhD,MD

 

[JWM]

Dr. Proctor

Do you believe the anecdotal reports of people thinning more towards the front of the scalp when starting Finasteride? If so, are these candidates who would likely benefit from something like topical spironolactone instead?

 

[pproctor]

Dr. Proctor

Do you believe the anecdotal reports of people thinning more towards the front of the scalp when starting Finasteride? If so, are these candidates who would likely benefit from something like topical spironolactone instead?

Don't know. Oral finasteride clearly produces reflex hyperandrogenicity. In fact, I personally think that this minimizes (say) sexual side-effects. In some persons, this is extreme enough that they actually exibit paradoxical hyperandrogenic side-effects. Whether this makes balding worse, I can't say.

However, because finasteride differentially "protects" the hair follicle, my wild guess is that it will not exacerbate balding except in the presence of other hyperandrogenic symptoms.

Peter H. Proctor, PhD,MD

 

[JWM]

Are you referring to concurent use of things like steroids etc.?

 

[Nuli]

Very effective/no risk of sides/Availability issues: RU

That isn't so sure.

I guess i should change it to "sexual sides". RU has been shown to work locally.

Dr.P,

Do the sexual side effects(low libido, ED) of finasteride come from the reduction of DHT in the body or a rise in estrogen?

 

[Bryan]

Topical-- spironolactone. Oral, finasteride.

On paper at least, spironolactone should be considerably more potent than finasteride. This is not our experience-- they seem to be about the same. We use it because it is not absorbed systematically to any significant extent and thus has minimal side-effects.

In my experience, looking for the "best" antiandrogen may be lost effort anyway. Reason is that there seems to be a barrier beyond which more antiandrogenic activity does not produce additional results.

I'll take this opportunity to show that no, I don't always agree in lock-step with everything that Dr. Proctor says!

I believe I have all the available studies on topically-applied spironolactone and RU58841 in hamsters, and they seem to demonstrate very clearly that RU58841 is a more effective topical antiandrogen than spironolactone. The greatest reduction in hamster flank organs (and sebaceous glands in general) that I've seen with spironolactone is only about 39% (and that was with a large dose -- smaller doses had less of an effect), whereas RU58841 produced about a 60% reduction, and was referred to in those studies as "castration-like".

So that's why I've always said that I believe that topical spironolactone is probably just a rather average or even mediocre antiandrogen, although it's obviously better than nothing at all. I just wish we had a cheap and reliable source for RU58841 available to us all.

 

[Empire]

I believe.. that even though it would be ridiculously expensive... 7.5% to 10% of RU58841 would be hands down.. without a doubt in the world.. the ultimate "cure"

If that much percentage cant bring your hair back.. even Jesus can't save you lol

 

[Empire]

Imagine 12.5% RU58841 if you could dilute it.

Jesus Christ.. you'd grow back hair from your previous life.

 

[Nuli]

I believe.. that even though it would be ridiculously expensive... 7.5% to 10% of RU58841 would be hands down.. without a doubt in the world.. the ultimate "cure"

If that much percentage cant bring your hair back.. even Jesus can't save you lol

Quoting Dr.P ,

"In my experience, looking for the "best" antiandrogen may be lost effort anyway. Reason is that there seems to be a barrier beyond which more antiandrogenic activity does not produce additional results.

For example, even castrated prostate cancer patients receiving high-dose flutamide don't reverse balding much. These people are about as antiandrogenized as you can get".

I wouldn't look to RU for much regrowth but, for maintenance it should work very well. To only find a cheap and reliable supplier....

 

[Empire]

I believe.. that even though it would be ridiculously expensive... 7.5% to 10% of RU58841 would be hands down.. without a doubt in the world.. the ultimate "cure"

If that much percentage cant bring your hair back.. even Jesus can't save you lol

Quoting Dr.P ,

"In my experience, looking for the "best" antiandrogen may be lost effort anyway. Reason is that there seems to be a barrier beyond which more antiandrogenic activity does not produce additional results.

For example, even castrated prostate cancer patients receiving high-dose flutamide don't reverse balding much. These people are about as antiandrogenized as you can get".

I wouldn't look to RU for much regrowth but, for maintenance it should work very well. To only find a cheap and reliable supplier....

I COMPLETELY disagree with you.

We are seeing people who are gaining regrow from finasteride alone.. and ppl even more dramatic results from Dutas.. I know a relative who used Dutas and filled in his crown within 4-6 months.

High percentage of RU (above the 5% tested that compared it to "castration-like" results) would basically sh*t all over Dutas.. so imagine the results that came with it.

RU has a huge affinity to the receptors.. way more than any of the androgens.. so imagine using a high percentage of something with that high affinity.. its like building a bomb shelter over a family to protect it from bird sh*t.