Topical Azelaic Acid As Potential Finasteride Alternative?

[Omega2327]

I stumbled upon an article from MinoxidilMax (they have some great products btw) that compared topical azelaic acid to finasteride and referenced a study that showed nice potential in azelaic acid as an inhibitor of 5ar (in high enough doses).

"In a study reported in the British Journal of Dermatology (Stamatiadis. 1988;119: 627-632), inhibition of 5-alpha reductase is virtually complete (98%) at 3 mmol/l. MinoxidilMax solutions contains 5% azelaic acid, which is 88 times the amount necessary for 98% inhibition of Type 1 and Type 2 5-alpha reductase in vitro. Both types of 5-alpha-reductase are present in the human scalp with Type 1 being the predominant isoenzyme. Allowing for the usual 4 or 5 percent absorption into the dermis and epidermis upon topical application, the amount of azelaic acid at the level of the hair follicles is at least 3 times the amount required for virtually complete inhibition of DHT synthesis."

The downside to the study is that it was done in vitro.... But still curious.. has anyone tried topical azelaic acid and had some level of success with it?

Link to the article:
https://www.minoxidilmax.com/azelaic-acid-for-hair-loss-review

Link to the study:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3207614

 

[BalderBaldyBald]

" 88 times the amount necessary for 98% inhibition of Type 1 and Type 2 5-alpha reductase in vitro"

sh*t that sentence is scary, i'm already despising taking finasteride...
And it will of course go systemic, personaly i wouldn't try it

But yeah, it can be more powerful than dutasteride on paper / in vitro
Just a reminder - even a 100% DHT reduction on scalp doesn't bring us back to NW0-1

 

[Seuxin]

It's totally FALSE, saddly, yeah, saddly, Azelaic Acid was tried for a lot of years by a lot of people and it totally has no effect as finasteride / dutasteride have.

 

[Omega2327]

" 88 times the amount necessary for 98% inhibition of Type 1 and Type 2 5-alpha reductase in vitro"

sh*t that sentence is scary, i'm already despising taking finasteride...
And it will of course go systemic, personaly i wouldn't try it

But yeah, it can be more powerful than dutasteride on paper / in vitro
Just a reminder - even a 100% DHT reduction on scalp doesn't bring us back to NW0-1

I just don't think azelaic acid would realistically produce side effects anywhere near the degree of finasteride/duta.. In that study, it also talks about topical zinc being an effective 5ar inhibitor (especially when combined with b6). There's just no way zinc would cause these types of sides as it is present in our food, in vitamin supplements, in suncsreen, shampoo, etc. Azelaic acid is an FDA approved drug commonly used to treat acne. It's known for its superior toxicological profile and I cannot find a single instance or report online of it causing sexual/psychological sides.

If you read the the article in my original post, it talks about how finasteride and azelaic acid have drastically different structures. finasteride is almost identical to testosterone and 5ar likes finasteride much more than testosterone, therefore any systemic finasteride goes through your system like a 5ar assassin binding to it very easily. With azelaic acid, I suspect that because it takes numerous azelaic acid molecules to inhibit 5ar, when topically applied, that dense array of molecules would potentially be effective on the scalp; however, amounts that go systemic would be significantly diluted throughout the bloodstream and therefore there would not be enough of it present at once to inhibit 5ar throughout the rest of the body.

Back to zinc, I was able to dig up a thread from back in the day in which @worm swears by its efficacy.

https://www.hairlosstalk.com/intera...ce-how-b6-and-zinc-have-saved-my-hair.101629/

Azelaic acid, zinc, and vitamin b6 combined could be the most effective.

 

[Janks16]

For a while there was a doctor in LA who added azelaic acid to 15% minoxidil that he would make for his patients. I was one of them, and both the 15% minoxidil and azelaic acid did nothing for me after two years.

 

[d3nt3dsh0v3l]

For a while there was a doctor in LA who added azelaic acid to 15% minoxidil that he would make for his patients. I was one of them, and both the 15% minoxidil and azelaic acid did nothing for me after two years.

Ah yes, Dr. Lee or whomever. I think Joe Rogan talks about him and that product in a podcast.

 

[jamesbooker1975]

The problem with AA, is that there was not a single ( incredible ) done in humans for Androgenetic Alopecia. It just have none sense why not a single university didn't try.
Dr. Lee products where so good, that piss off Merck and Upjon/pzifer and they make it to the FDA to shut down his business.

I still thing that tretinoin ( even is more irritating ) should be first choice, since, it is prove that it work by itself and it also have synergistic effect when it is using it with minoxidil ( since it increase the enzyme that convert minoxidil into active minoxidil ) .

 

[jamesbooker1975]

It's totally FALSE, saddly, yeah, saddly, Azelaic Acid was tried for a lot of years by a lot of people and it totally has no effect as finasteride / dutasteride have.

According to who ? I hear the same thing about tretinoin, lol.

 

[Omega2327]

For a while there was a doctor in LA who added azelaic acid to 15% minoxidil that he would make for his patients. I was one of them, and both the 15% minoxidil and azelaic acid did nothing for me after two years.

Interesting. What % concentration was the AA in the product you were using? And I assume you didn’t get any sides you’d attribute to AA?

 

[Janks16]

Interesting. What % concentration was the AA in the product you were using? And I assume you didn’t get any sides you’d attribute to AA?

I didn't get any sides using the 15% minoxidil with AA. I'm not certain of the % concentration that Dr. Lee put in the minoxidil. That was a long time ago. Some time around 1989 or so.

 

[whatevr]

Lauric acid is a saturated fatty acid which is good at inhibiting both types of 5AR in free-form (you can easily buy it, it comes as crystal-like flakes of fat).

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12477490
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19353546

However, it will go systemic topically and have similar sides to Finasteride.

Zinc has only been shown to inhibit 5AR1 with no activity on 5AR2 so any improvement in hair loss due to topical zinc is not likely to be due to any antiandrogenic action on the hair follicle.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7738354

 

[losingbattle88]

Just stop messing around with useless treatments and wasting precious TIME, get on oral dutasteride DHT is a trash hormone been on oral for 5 months soon and my libido is exactly the same as are my boners.

 

[theronin]

Just stop messing around with useless treatments and wasting precious TIME, get on oral dutasteride DHT is a trash hormone been on oral for 5 months soon and my libido is exactly the same as are my boners.

DHT a trash hormone?? OMG, you need to educate yourself.....

 

[losingbattle88]

DHT a trash hormone?? OMG, you need to educate yourself.....

I admit it does have an effect on your sperm I have noticed it lowers it. But I can live with that I just ejaculate every few days instead. But that's the only side I got.