No Pillow !

bodysnatcher

bodysnatcher

Established Member
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I'm looking for opinions on this theory.

It has been suggested (but not confirmed) that blood flow (or lack of) can in part contribue to male pattern baldness.

I usually sleep with 2 pillows under my head but recently i have not been sleeping on any pillows, i figure that if you sleep on your front (obviously with your head tilted to the side) your head is at the same height, if not lower than your heart for 8 hours a day, thus increasing the blood flow substantialy.

Could there be any negitive efects of doing this (Increased DHT or Sebum to the effected areas)?

I imagine no one could prove this theory correct or incorrect, i'm just looking for opinions.

Thank You
 
M

michael barry

Senior Member
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Hi Bodysnatcher,
Microcapillary blood flow in balding scalps was found to be on average 2.6 times less than on hairy ones. It seems as if (according to Dr. Loren Pickart and a few other sources too) that the microcapillaries at the bottom of the dermal papilla dont grow back to full size in ensuing new anagen hair cycles over time, thus not delivering proper nutrition to the follicle. There are other reasons for hair miniaturizing (immune system trying to kill the hair for as of yet unkown reasones), but some feel the smaller microcapillaries may have a big role in this.

Tom Hagerty posted a study from 2001 in which a Doctor gave alopecic rodents a protien that upgraded VEGF factors which help angiogenesis (new capillary formations) and the rodents turned their little vellus hairs into big thick terminal hairs. There was some seventy percent increase in hair mass because the small hairs that most of us have (unless fibrosis has taken place) are still there. The head Doctor of the study postulated that bald men might simply have much smaller micocapillaries as a result of the male pattern baldness process in their heads than hairy men, and this could be the big trigger for miniaturization. I feel many would disagree with that, but that is what the doctor who ran the study thought. He's seeking to further test the protien that grew capillaries on rodents further and to try it on humans at some point.

Ive wondered about pillow height myself and whether a man might increase blood flow a little by simply having blood weight rest on the scalp capillaries pressing downwards before. I have no idea whether this would signal the body to lengthen the capillaries though. I doubt docs have any info on something like this either........Might be worth a try to run it past a Doctor if you know one.....see what he thinks and post his response. Cant hurt, huh? : )
 
A

Administrator

Guest
There is no doubt hair loss is multi-factoral. One could logically say that nearly 10 different things are a "contributing factor" to male pattern baldness. That's why its so difficult to treat. When you have treatments like Propecia however that seem to have an 83% success rate, its logical to assume we've figured out one of the most influential factors.

Keep in mind that one thing can *cause* many other things. If DHT is the cause, increased sebum, inflammation, change in capillaries, and numerous other things can be a result. Will addressing those other things equate to a cure? Probably not, but there is no doubt that those other things exascerbate (sp?) and possibly speed up the process of balding.

Its also been well established that agitation of any kind can stimulate short term hair growth. All these things play a role!

Interesting discussion either way.

Admin
 
powersam

powersam

Senior Member
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word to your mother.

might also be worth stating that what works for one may not work for the other as the different profiles of each persons hairloss can be as different and varied as the factors involved therein. one man might be bald due to overly dht sensitive follicles, one due to to much dht, one from thyroid problems et al. non responders to the conventional treatments (bombscience) would probably benefit from looking for other reasons for their hairloss.
 
elguapo

elguapo

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I don't mean to question the whole theory of DHT being the main cause of male pattern baldness. I am using proscar 1/4 every day, and this has been working in keeping me from losing more hair since I startet propecia/finasteride 2 years ago.

But I do want to encourage an openmindedness toward other theories besides the widely excepted (and "proven") "DHT is the cause of male pattern baldness" mantra. On that note, I, too, like this discussion. Though, I also suffer from Rosacea, which makes me fearful of anything that promotes the enhancement of VEGF or otherwise vasculature development.

Let's agree that the current meds available- minoxidil and finasteride- DO work for the vast majority of us, to a great extent. But let us not forget that the "cure" to male pattern baldness is yet to be found, and we should not assume that our theories regarding the cause of male pattern baldness are absolutely correct.
 
mvpsoft

mvpsoft

Experienced Member
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I sleep on one very, very flat pillow, almost like not having a pillow. Slept that way for years. And I've been losing hair all those years.
 
M

michael barry

Senior Member
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Admin,
On Propecia. A while back a really nice (and very good according to photos of his work) transplant doctor named Michael Beehner emailed me on a question I had regarding Propecia. He stated that studies showed that Propecia gives men higher hair counts per square inch for about 5 years, the new increases taper off and then every ensuing year, there are less hairs per square inch. In about 14 years the user is in about the state he was when he started propecia. Still losing hair, but MUCH slower than what he was before. So If you just start propecia when your hair loss begins, you might be buying 20-25 years before the mid-anterior top and vertex really begin to noticeably bald. This was when propecia is used ALONE.

Dr. Ivy Greenwell had an article where she stated that propecia stops almost 70% of blood serum levels of DHT, but only 34% of scalp levels. Dutasteride supposedly stops over 90% of DHT, but so many fear it may eventually be either carcinogenic or have other health risks if used for many years. I personally bite a propecia tablet in half every day, because studies indicate that .5mg of finasteride has almost the same punch as a whole tablet does.

Ive wondered that when too much DHT gets in androgen receptors if the follicles stem cell instructions to its various parts gets muddled in some way............resulting in over secreting sebaceous glands or capillaries not re-enlarging enough in the hairs next anagen phase.......or something going wrong that makes the immune system see the follicle as a foreign body. However, when Ive read various sites and seen what dutasteride users have to say........................it seems as if the drug that almost stops all DHT is something of a bomb. SO many say they dont see any difference with propecia or dont see much frontal regrowth at all.

Ive wondered whetether androstenidione, cortisol, some estrogens, DHEAS or other hormones might be involved in temporal recession explicitly...................where propecia and dutasteride dont seem to help. I know a "baldness" gene hasnt been found, but various genes seem to be what bring about conditions for male pattern baldness to take place. Like many, Im kinda baffled that science hasnt cured this yet. I was so confident when I was a teenager in the 80's that male pattern baldness would be cured by the time I was an adult, but it seems to be so much more complicated than just male hormones. Have you heard of any research on new drugs etc?
 
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