How to maximize result of DHT blockers and deny side effects

[tomas99]

Guys,

I have got it! :lol:

started 1/4 Proscar 10 days ago, but I will add something more into my regimen which I think will boost my results and deny any side effects. This is (not only mine) theory.

It is based on many studies which say that DHT is human natural Aromatase inhibitor = aromatase is something that convert Testosterone into Estrogens, so similar to 5-alpha.

Facts: Higher Testosterone does not mean balding. Men who are balding have average levels of T, but higher levels of DHT (especially in scalp). When males are older, they have less T but higher Estrogens and higher levels of DHT. If body produce more Testosterone, more of it will convert into Estrogens through Aromatase.

Estrogens are important even for man, but they cause (even in little excess) those things that happen to woman and what happen to guys who started with Finasteride - brain fog, weight gain, erection problems etc. These are exactly the same effects that are caused by excess of Estrogens in men!

So you block 5-alpha, more T is converted into Estrogens and Estrogens are causing side effects + body still can try to raise 5-alpha because wants naturally inhibit these Estrogens.

This leads to fact that if your aromatase is very low, there is no need to have higher 5-alpha for body. So aim should be to have high T, low aromatase and low 5-alpha. Just by lowering aromatase could be OK, raised T could convert easily to 5-alpha so it is necessary to block 5-alpha too.

Also, Estrogen receptors could act as androgen receptors. And is involved in path way which signals another hormones to start killing of hair follicles (generally speaking). This is great study to understand this:

http://home.arcor.de/gekkehenk/HW/HW Topical/03. Role of TGF-beta2 in the human hair cycle..pdf

Aromatase inhibitors are (not talking about drugs):
Pomegranate extract (must contain punicaligans)
Resveratrol
DIM
7 HMR lignans
Grape Seed Extract

+ find which food is Estrogenic and which is anti-estrogenic.

Plus of course using Finasteride and another DHT blockers is important too, HMR lignans (which could help) and nettle root + green tea possibly.

These all (except Finasteride) just don't inhibit aromatase, but are great antioxidants, TGF-b and TNF-a blockers (enzymes involved in hair cells death) and great for overall (heart etc.) health. Also no problems with erection and you should gain more muscles, less body hair and be more manly due to high T.

More estrogen is not something that will save men hair. It will cause side effects and tell body to produce more DHT to inhibit excess of this Estrogen. If you block just 5-alpha, Estrogens will raise, cause so called side effects and your T will automatically be lower.
I will add these supplements into my regiment and will tell you in few months.

IT IS A CIRCLE - you block DHT which inhibits aromatase - but Aromatase than raise so there is more DHT needed by body. You can never achieve satisfying results and will also have side effects and risk cancer somehow. You must solve what raise 5-alpha - it can be bad diet (Omega 6 : Omega 3 ratio should be 1:1 but in America it is 20-50:1), insulin resistance but mainly it is higher aromatase. Also lot of antioxidants are needed as when there is oxidative stress, hair follicles are more sensitive to hormonal attacts.

This makes very sense - young guys have highest Testosterone, but lowest DHT. And I think that Aromatase, low initake of Omega 3 and too much sugar and refined food is the reason why 5-alpha is so high. High Aromatase is probably that what causes breast and prostate cancer - because it can support affected cells and also significantly higher DHT levels.

Check also this about Aromatase inhibiting:

http://www.regrowth.com/hairloss-forums/viewthread.cfm?f=1&t=15128

and also find which food is anti-inflammatory and pro-inflammatory. Inti-inflammatory should help too.

SUMMARY

- inhibiting aromatase (not all of it!)
- inhibiting 5-alpha (not all of it!)
- high initake of Omega 3 (plus avoiding pro-inflammatory food which raises 5-alpha too)
- many many antioxidants (oxidative stress can damage cells and DNA)
- lowering refined food (sugar, vegetable oils - that raises 5-alpha too and also there are studies which confirm too much insulin can cause vertex balding)
- anti-estrogenic food should


IMHO this should at least STOP hairloss and solve this problem - I hope it will bring much more better regrowth than Finasteride at any dosage. There is science behind all of this and DHT is simply the result of all of this. You must attack the cause at first and it will give you much better results and better health than using Finasteride alone.

---------

AT LEAST CHECK THIS STUDY: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entre ... med_docsum

If you do not respond to Finasteride, your insuline-like growth hormone is probably too low (and you can suffer from insulin resistance). Just search and study how to raise your IGF-1 and what is causing low IGF-1 and you should respond to Finasteride better.

 

[Harie]

Exactly what I've been saying all along...Though I decrease my estrogen levels with 0.25mg Anastrozole EOD.

Your sig is interesting. My IGF levels should be high, I'd think, since I drink 2 gallons of milk per week. IGF link below.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entre ... t=Abstract

 

[youngbaldie]

Excellent post Tomas, very informative.

I have heard soy raises IGF-1. I take soy isoflavones (in conjunction with much iodine to prevent thyroid problems) and have completely replaced my dairy with soy products.

There are some reports out there that soy isoflavones, particularly genistein help with hair growth. I also take Green Tea Extract with it, along with large amounts of Fish oil.

I have been taking this for several months. Side effects seem to be sexual in nature. But I believe it has slowed male pattern baldness to some extent and has helped slightly with the itch.

I am however concerned about Soy raising estrogen levels. Any thoughts on this?

Some docs, I think Dr. Proctor have stated that estrogen isn't bad for hair, but I am not sure what to believe about this.

Oh yeah, luckily, as of yet, I have no signs of gyno, although I sometimes feel some soreness there, but no breast enlargement luckily.

 

[spinner2]

Great post. I was looking into a lot of this stuff earlier today, and thinking some about this. From everything I've read, your hypothesis has been supported fully.

 

[Guest]

Could someone list the products to avoid and the products that raise IGF-1 levels? At least I drink a lot of milk, someone mentioned that milk had something to do with it. I've been trying to reduce the use of sugar and junk food.

 

[Pete]

Re: How to maximize result of DHT blockers and deny side eff

Guys,

I have got it! :lol:

started 1/4 Proscar 10 days ago, but I will add something more into my regimen which I think will boost my results and deny any side effects. This is (not only mine) theory.

It is based on many studies which say that DHT is human natural Aromatase inhibitor = aromatase is something that convert Testosterone into Estrogens, so similar to 5-alpha.

Facts: Higher Testosterone does not mean balding. Men who are balding have average levels of T, but higher levels of DHT (especially in scalp). When males are older, they have less T but higher Estrogens and higher levels of DHT. If body produce more Testosterone, more of it will convert into Estrogens through Aromatase.

Estrogens are important even for man, but they cause (even in little excess) those things that happen to woman and what happen to guys who started with Finasteride - brain fog, weight gain, erection problems etc. These are exactly the same effects that are caused by excess of Estrogens in men!

So you block 5-alpha, more T is converted into Estrogens and Estrogens are causing side effects + body still can try to raise 5-alpha because wants naturally inhibit these Estrogens.

This leads to fact that if your aromatase is very low, there is no need to have higher 5-alpha for body. So aim should be to have high T, low aromatase and low 5-alpha. Just by lowering aromatase could be OK, raised T could convert easily to 5-alpha so it is necessary to block 5-alpha too.

Also, Estrogen receptors could act as androgen receptors. And is involved in path way which signals another hormones to start killing of hair follicles (generally speaking). This is great study to understand this:

http://home.arcor.de/gekkehenk/HW/HW Topical/03. Role of TGF-beta2 in the human hair cycle..pdf

Aromatase inhibitors are (not talking about drugs):
Pomegranate extract (must contain punicaligans)
Resveratrol
DIM
7 HMR lignans
Grape Seed Extract

+ find which food is Estrogenic and which is anti-estrogenic.

Plus of course using Finasteride and another DHT blockers is important too, HMR lignans (which could help) and nettle root + green tea possibly.

These all (except Finasteride) just don't inhibit aromatase, but are great antioxidants, TGF-b and TNF-a blockers (enzymes involved in hair cells death) and great for overall (heart etc.) health. Also no problems with erection and you should gain more muscles, less body hair and be more manly due to high T.

More estrogen is not something that will save men hair. It will cause side effects and tell body to produce more DHT to inhibit excess of this Estrogen. If you block just 5-alpha, Estrogens will raise, cause so called side effects and your T will automatically be lower.
I will add these supplements into my regiment and will tell you in few months.

IT IS A CIRCLE - you block DHT which inhibits aromatase - but Aromatase than raise so there is more DHT needed by body. You can never achieve satisfying results and will also have side effects and risk cancer somehow. You must solve what raise 5-alpha - it can be bad diet (Omega 6 : Omega 3 ratio should be 1:1 but in America it is 20-50:1), insulin resistance but mainly it is higher aromatase. Also lot of antioxidants are needed as when there is oxidative stress, hair follicles are more sensitive to hormonal attacts.

This makes very sense - young guys have highest Testosterone, but lowest DHT. And I think that Aromatase, low initake of Omega 3 and too much sugar and refined food is the reason why 5-alpha is so high. High Aromatase is probably that what causes breast and prostate cancer - because it can support affected cells and also significantly higher DHT levels.

Check also this about Aromatase inhibiting:

http://www.regrowth.com/hairloss-forums/viewthread.cfm?f=1&t=15128

and also find which food is anti-inflammatory and pro-inflammatory. Inti-inflammatory should help too.

SUMMARY

- inhibiting aromatase (not all of it!)
- inhibiting 5-alpha (not all of it!)
- high initake of Omega 3 (plus avoiding pro-inflammatory food which raises 5-alpha too)
- many many antioxidants (oxidative stress can damage cells and DNA)
- lowering refined food (sugar, vegetable oils - that raises 5-alpha too and also there are studies which confirm too much insulin can cause vertex balding)
- anti-estrogenic food should


IMHO this should at least STOP hairloss and solve this problem - I hope it will bring much more better regrowth than Finasteride at any dosage. There is science behind all of this and DHT is simply the result of all of this. You must attack the cause at first and it will give you much better results and better health than using Finasteride alone.

---------

AT LEAST CHECK THIS STUDY: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entre ... med_docsum

If you do not respond to Finasteride, your insuline-like growth hormone is probably too low (and you can suffer from insulin resistance). Just search and study how to raise your IGF-1 and what is causing low IGF-1 and you should respond to Finasteride better.

I will try to answer most of your points :


1) If you are trying to reduce Estradiol ALONE look into :

Pumpkin seed oil (cucubita pepo)
Pygeum Africanum (Prunus africana) bark extract
Chrysin


2) If you are considering blocking DHT and Estradiol you can look into Epilobium:

http://www.hairlosstalk.com/discussions/viewtopic.php?t=2168


3) Including things like chromium will help balance blood sugar levels.


I am interested to know where you found such an article - do have links as I have held a similar view for a while??

More estrogen is not something that will save men hair. It will cause side effects and tell body to produce more DHT to inhibit excess of this Estrogen. If you block just 5-alpha, Estrogens will raise, cause so called side effects and your T will automatically be lower.
I will add these supplements into my regiment and will tell you in few months.

IT IS A CIRCLE - you block DHT which inhibits aromatase - but Aromatase than raise so there is more DHT needed by body. You can never achieve satisfying results and will also have side effects and risk cancer somehow.

Regards
Pete

 

[tomas99]

I would be careful about soy. It has some Estrogenic effects, but on the other side it could help. Check this list of Estrogenic and anti-E food, you will find many others http://www.holisticonline.com/Remedies/Hrt/hrt_food_and_estrogen.htm

Well I don't know if drinking milk is good idea, because it is usually pasteurized milk and that could not be absorbed well by the body. Refined dairy could be harmful as other refined food....

youngbaldie - well some Estrogens are good and some bad (worst is the most potent one - Estradiol). You need some Estrogens for your bones etc.

Pete - yes pumpkin seeds are excellent for hair. Chrysin is great, but I is little more expensive than others, that's why I am not going to use it yet. Also maca root would be useful.

Google is excellent way to find all studies. Just write green tea aromatase, nettle Aromatase, nettle DHT, Pomegranate Aromatase and like this and you will find tons of studies.

Great resource is http://www.regrowth.com and many of these teories or rather studies and procedures are described by very sophisticated person Immortal hair. If you check his website http://www.freewebs.com/immortalhair/mycurrentregimen.htm you will realize that most of his TOP 6 does match to what I have written and to tons of studies.

7 HMR - helps balance Estrogens and DHT

nettle root - antioxidant (help against oxidative stress you are experiencing after each exercise or even short run to catch your bus)

green tea (antioxidant)

Cod Liver Oil - huge intake of Omega 3 + Vitamin D. Inflammation is caused by low intake of Omega 3 (fish, seafood, olives, nuts etc.) and high intake of Omega 6 (other meat, fried food, junk food etc.)

Lipoic acid - helps to lower your blood sugar (remember studies about vertex balding connected to insulin resistance)? If you are eating high-glycemic food whole the day more insulin is needed and through all the time you are less sensitive to it which produce even more insuline.... I am not using this anymore cause my metabolism is pretty high naturally so I am losing weight on this.

Using natural way is not charlatanish as someone could think - it is the same way like using finasteride, but it can be more safe and mainly - much more comprehensive, because you for example do not cover only levels of DHT, but also its effect on follicles other hormones involved in the whole balding process etc. Your follicles could be less sensitive to DHT, there could be less inflammation in your skin which would causes that you will lower auto-immune response that is responsible for falling your hair out etc.

One would wonder that Asians living at Asia {where with no influence of western civilization} have great hair, but those that come to Europe and are living there for some time (and thus eating in another, western-way) start developing temples and vertex balding.... I bet that people living on some island where is no refined food and no chemicals don't know what acne or cancer is. Do you think it is coincidence?

From my view, Finasteride is OK as long as you have no liver problems and no sides (sure it is not OK to take any drugs but what can men do?), but it is definitely not enough in long term - you will not HALT your MBP just by using finasteride or dutasteride for 10-15 years, unless your recession is minimal and very very very slow.

DHT on its own is not causing baldness. It just triggers the whole process. BUt it can be also triggered by something different. OR it seems that it is triggere by many things. You can say that if someone gets T injected, he will go bald thus T causes baldness directly. But this is misleading information, cause T converts to DHT by 5-alpha (and how much DHT will be converted depends on many factors) and DHT is then stimulating TGF-betas etc, so it begins with hormones, but their effects on the whole body could be influenced.

Just check this article http://www.hairloss-research.org/february1.html. Finasteride or lowering DHT is only one angle, there is TGF-beta family, TNF-alpha, caspace 3, PKC and others hormones that are involved in balding process. Do you see how many aspects that guy covered to achieve his success?

This study is great, you can see the whole pathway begins with T and continues through 5-alpha and Aromatase, stimulating TGF-beta and other and finally resulting in hair cells death:
http://home.arcor.de/gekkehenk/HW/HW Topical/03. Role of TGF-beta2 in the human hair cycle..pdf

You can not treat such complicated issue like male pattern baldness by one pill and it can never be done this way. Only cure would be to change genes. If you block DHT totally, you would have horrible side effects. TGF-beta is also important immune enzyme. Inhibit it completely and you won't lose your hair anymore. But you will probably die soon due to another reason because you need it. So really comprehensive attitude must be started and you must fight male pattern baldness from every possible angle - change your diet rapidly, detoxify your body (do you know that if your liver or colon does not work properly, it can affect all hormones and thus hair??) regularly, protect your body agains oxidative stress, and prefer food that is good for hair (it is good because it can somehow regulate those hormones you want have regulated) and the list goes on....

If you want to reverse your baldness - by which I mean that those thin hair you have will be thick and healthy as others and you will not lose your hair during years and perhaps regrowth some hair, you will never be enought only with finasteride or Dutasteride. So I am trying to go this way, just check my regimen and you will see what I mean. And I am right now at the start of my comprehensive treatment

There is no magic pill that will stop male pattern baldness and NEVER will be. But to completely change your life style is necessary. It is much more harder than eating one pill, isnt it? There is so much that trigger MBP - hormonal imbalance, inflammation, high insulin fluctulation, oxidative stress .... finasteride is useful, but I am well aware that using only Finasteride is like drinking each night and than taking Ibuprofen in the morning because you suffer from headache and handover. Why just don't stop drinking and thus solve the cause of the problem?

P.S. I have heard of many peoples that spend some time on detox program e.g. in Asia countries - eating only vegetables and fruit, only whole grain and fiber, only fish, sea food and free-range chicken. Drinking only water and teas and some herbs. No refined food at all. After this they felt so much better and realized that they have some hair at places that were completely bald for years - what a surprise!

P.P.S. I am not able to do spell check as I am really exhausted so sorry for spelling-mistakes, no offence against English

 

[tomas99]

OH and one thing that I think that if there are some people which do not respond to Finasteride, they are not just poor respondends. Their male pattern baldness could be caused by something different (e.g. inflammation, oxidative stress) which triggers cascade effects. Because if your hair could only be attacked by 2 5-alpha or if just DHT would cause your thinning, there is simply now way how it can be accelerated if you lower or inhibit the trigger (DHT).

 

[jedimindtricks]

Ok, sorry about asking for this, but what is the ultimate diet for blocking DHT and anti-oxidants and stuff?

Like what would I need to eat daily to prevent me from balding. I am 18 years old and I do not show any signs of balding yet, but I would like to prevent it if possible

 

[tomas99]

Eating as close to nature as possible is best way.

Refined food is everything which is not fresh, whole grain, sweetened etc. Also it is best to prefer low-glycemic food.

I think it is really not possible to stay away from this food so it is important to take supplements. If you can, stay away from coca cola, junk food, refined dairy, vegetable oils (use only olive oil for frying or coconut oil), if you can eat free-range chickens and grass-fed animals. Grass-fed animals are from bio farms and it is meat in condition in which should be - I suppose that at the beginning, cow was supposed to eat grass and not some geneticaly modified grains in a farm, am I right? Also, it is better to eat wild losos than farmed losos.

It is. And lower your sugar initake. If you want to eat chocolate, eat only with high % of cacao like 70% and more. It is great anti-oxidant.

Food is important because it can affect your system and thus hormonal balance/imbalance in possitive way. However, most of the todays food (90% of what people eat and somethimes 100%) affect liver, colon, kidney in wrong way and these organs than have negative way on your hormonal balance.

Antioxidants
http://www.1stvitality.co.uk/az/antioxidants/antioxidants.htm
http://www.naturalhealthtechniques.com/Diet_Nutrition/antioxidant_list_&_foods.htm

Inflammatory food (pro and anti, choose anti of course
http://nutrition.about.com/od/dietsformedicaldisorders/a/antiinflamfood.htmhttp://www.alive.com/4228a12a2.php?subject_bread_cramb=188
http://www.metabolismadvice.com/anti_inflammatory_food/

Superfoods
http://www.3fatchicks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=90444http://www.nutripeople.co.uk/super_healing_foods_index.asp

Only examples, you will find much more. These things will also prevent you from getting cancer and other crap. You can compare by yourselve - how many % of your food initake consist of french fries, red meat, limonades, bread, potatoes, sweets, fast food, junk food and how many of whole grain, frech vegetable, seafood etc?

All I can tell you that in my country, we have one of the worst diet in Western civilization, terrible for overall health. We are maybe first in colon cancer and also baldness is there so common that it is considered as absolutely normal that you are bald. Guys that are 18-20 years old have receeded temples and guy over 30 with no temples - well I have never seen that one, maybe one of the 500? Asians have no cancer, they dont know acne, but I will stop there. I really believe that food can affect your hormones and body in such way that no one even realize.

 

[jedimindtricks]

So you think that balding can be prevented without medicines and just food?

 

[JWM]

Bryan Shelton is going to show up any moment now and wreak more havoc than Godzilla on a bender.

 

[spinner2]

So you think that balding can be prevented without medicines and just food?

Wouldn't go that far, but you need to have your diet in order if you want any chance to fight male pattern baldness. Things like inflammation, insulin-resistance, overall health all have to be in order if you want a chance at success. Clearly this isn't enough for some people, as baldness has existed far before processed foods, so DHT blockers are probably needed for most on top of this.

 

[docj077]

I have two problems with this and I'm sure that someone else will bring up others.

First, increasing IGF-1 at the tissue level or in serum is probably not a good idea. Maintaining a constant level by not allowing for insulin spikes and the subsequent increase in growth hormone release IS a good idea. Increased IGF-1 levels in the scalp is associated with vertex baldness and and elevated IGF-1 is also associated with prostate cancer. DHT itself is quite likely what upregulates the production of IGF-1 in balding scalp. Another excellent observation to make is that increased estrogen or progesterone levels do increase growth hormone production, and thus, IGF-1 production in tissues. So, if you enjoy looking at mechanisms all day, then you'll probably see that 5AR inhibition will cause a mild increase in estrogen as testosterone can either be converted or bind to the androgen receptor (although weakly at best).

The proof for this mechanism lies in the fact that testosterone administration causes an increase in growth hormone and IGF-1 in boys. However, this process does not occur in the presence of non-aromatizable androgens which means that estrogen and aromatase are required for the process to occur.

The second problem I have with all of this is that no one really knows how estrogen works when it comes to male pattern baldness. The application of estrogen in pre-pubertal females OR males to the sites of future sexual hair growth actually causes hair growth in those areas. In fact, particular forms of estrogen are actually REQUIRED to maintain hair growth at particular rates. The estrogen receptor and the androgen receptor obviously co-localize and seem to work together in some instances, but I'm very unsure about this mechanism as I've never seen a study involving hair that demonstrated that increased estrogen in the scalp does anything to scalp hair growth in terms of density, rate of growth, or the effect it has on other hormones produced or binding within the vicinity of the follicle.


So, you guys can go this route if you like, but it might actually be the estrogen that is helping you in the long run. The response to finasteride could be based more upon the density of aromatase in the scalp and other tissues like the testes (which produce about 80% of male estrogen, I believe) than anything else in terms of IGF-1 production once five alpha reductase is inhibited.


This is an interesting topic, but more research is required.

 

[Bryan]

Increased IGF-1 levels in the scalp is associated with vertex baldness

Do you have a reference or citation for that claim? That would appear to contradict the material I posted recently over on HLH saying that IGF-1 is a powerful mitogen for hair follicles.

DHT itself is quite likely what upregulates the production of IGF-1 in balding scalp.

I'd really like to see some evidence for that, or even just that IGF-1 is "associated" with balding.

 

[Bertie]

...I've never seen a study involving hair that demonstrated that increased estrogen in the scalp does anything to scalp hair growth in terms of density, rate of growth, or the effect it has on other hormones produced or binding within the vicinity of the follicle.

Well, there's the study discussed here:
http://www.hairlosshelp.com/forums/mess ... TARTPAGE=1

 

[tomas99]

These supplements are not just about Estrogens, they help to lower TGF-beta 1 (and perhaps 2), which is one of the most important factors that is happening in balding. They are also great antioxidants. There were also some studies which pointed to fact that grape seed promoted hair growth somehow.

I wouldnt talk about progesterone and estrogen in the same way, in fact progesterone is enzyme that inhibit conversion from T to Estrogens and also inhibit 5-alpha. When you are getting older, progesterone is going down and you start to suffer from Estrogen dominancy (just search this term, it is very interesting).

So generally, progesterone is very useful and vital enzyme. It is at its peak when women are pregnant. Just ask your mother how was her hair during pregnancy. I bet she will tell you it was great and thick. Mine told me that and you can see it, just look for pregnant women, then have very thick hair. After child is born, progesterone goes down and many women is experiencing shedding and losing some hair. So progesterone protect you.

If you mean that blocking aromatase (by this I mean lowering) and 5-alpha, that higher T would bind to androgen receptors - well T must by many times weaker than DHT and DHT also bind to receptors more easily. The fact that T is by far weaker in this way can be prooven on young guys - teenagers. Most of them have very high T, but still not balding. They start balding when getting older, T is lower and DHT even little bit higher.

Sure I dont mean to block estrogens, but just those bad one (like Estradiol). That should result in less DHT, too. You need Estrogens for your bones and general health so you are right, but I would prefer those that are harmless. Like I prefer more T over DHT

Check this overview, it is from one study:
http://www.regrowth.com/hairloss-forums ... =6&t=15266

It makes some sence that growth hormone is simply needed if you want your hair to grow You should have HGH (human growth hormone) and IGH (insulin growth hormone) not too low because your hair would suffer from this. However, I suppose that is should not be also too high.

After all, women that are older more likely suffer from male pattern baldness than young girls. And when women are getting older, their Estrogen levels are raising. Which means that high Estrogens (it depends which one, there are many of them) does not protect hair. More POTENT Estrogen can cause that it binds to androgen receptors somehow or it raises 5-alpha. As long as progesterone is high, T is high and DHT and most potent Estradiol are low or in lower levels, it seems that balding is not hapenning. So T and weak estrogens have very small potential or power when binding to androgen receptors in hair follicles.

You can find study which say high T was presented in balding men (also you can find once which says that balding men had low T), but this could mean that this high T is causing high DHT. I have never seen study which says that high T and very low DHT is presented in balding head.

 

[tomas99]

I am reading Bryans post and I think that using just Estrogens is not very handy. Estrogens is same as Androgens, but not all Androge cause or trigger male pattern baldness. Some of them are very helpful and some of them are harmful.

Btw. Bryan could you be more specific about what you think about Estrogens - and which one exactly?

 

[HairLessGR]

HI Tomas! thanks for the informative mail, yet i'm now too brain fogged to fully understand it.
I can tell you however that i pay great attention to my diet. I haven't eaten to any fast food for years now, i've rarely consumed soft drinks in my life while for 4 months now my only sweets are basically chocolate 70%, yogurt with honey and walnuts and apples with honey and cinnamon while 75% of all my food is biological. Needeles to say i don't eat chips, no food from tins , only olive oil which i happen to produce myself, and my only drink apart of lots of water is real orange juice.
Maybe it is pure coincidence but all the gain i had from using minoxidil since april '06 (we're talking about 30% more hair!!) has now disappeared from this terrible shedding i have since april this year. I am back to where i was and no sign the shedding will stop. I am losing so much hair from the entire scalp that i am frightened i will go completely bald.
Anyway. I do think your food instructions are correct but i am not so sure whether they'll help you/us with hair.

By the way. If this doesn't stop since Monday i'll add avodart to my regime. 4 days finasteride, 2 days dutasteride, 1 day zero. I'll keep you informed of course.
bye

 

[tomas99]

I would really like to know some study about Estrogen levels in young boys, I would be really useful to know.

Anyway, how can estrogen protect your hair if those that suffer from estrogen dominance simply suffer from hair loss?

HairLessGR
About minoxidil, it is something totally different. Hair you have gained from minoxidil does not growth natural way, you just support follicles with something that is not already presented so it is some kind of "wig" (talking about Minoxidil hair) in fact. If you have gained 30% of hair from Minoxidil, they are just Minoxidil hair and they will never be like real hair, so noone can guarantee that you will never lost them. I prefer at this point hair that is healthy even under your skin - and minoxidil hair is not, it is just missing something that healthy hair has and you are supplying it with tonic.

To diet, I think that diet really helps, but it is not enough and everyone should take many supplements that provide you with concentration you can never get from food. Also, you can suffer from something different, I dont know some other disease which is causing your hormonal imbalance, who knows...