Folligen vs. Tricomin

[Snarfleflous]

Does anyone have any opinions on which one is better? I started with Folligen last fall...I'm not sure I'm seeing any results other than a distressing winter shed.

According to the hairlosstalk.com site, it seems as if the only difference is that Folligen is cheaper.

Also, has anyone ever experienced shedding after starting a copper peptide, especially after being on the "big 3" for awhile?

 

[Cassin]

I prefer Tricomin since it is much cleaner. I don't look like the hulk pissed on my head when I use Tricomin.

Both are fine products but I chose to spend more for cosmetic reasons.

 

[blaze]

Cassin what do you apply first, minoxidil or tricomin?

Dr Lees minoxidil dries fast, but tricomin doesnt. But could tricomin dilute Lees minoxidil since it has water in it?

 

[Cassin]

Cassin what do you apply first, minoxidil or tricomin?

Dr Lees minoxidil dries fast, but tricomin doesnt. But could tricomin dilute Lees minoxidil since it has water in it?

Well, I used to apply Minoxidil first but Bryan claims Copper Peptides need to go first so I go by what he says (unless it his politics .

I typically apply my CP's....wait about an hour or whenever and apply my roagine foam.

Also, I use CP's about 2 or 3 times a week. Sometimes I wonder if I use it enough to be effective. I do rub it into my scalp for a good minute so I know the cp's are getting absorbed into my scalp but is my scalp getting enough cp's in terms of frequency? I don't know.

I also wonder the same with my infrequent use of Nizoral.

 

[Bryan]

I find it fascinating that Dr. Pickart was reported to have said that it might actually be better to apply Folligen every other day, rather than every day!

Bryan

 

[Cassin]

I find it fascinating that Dr. Pickart was reported to have said that it might actually be better to apply Folligen every other day, rather than every day!

Not only that, he recommends watering down his solution in distilled water if you find it too strong. And to take breaks from treatments.

Wish I still had the email.......

So what do you think Bryan...am I wasting my time by going at the minimal application approach?

 

[jh]

Well, I used to apply Minoxidil first but Bryan claims Copper Peptides need to go first so I go by what he says (unless it his politics .

Why? (Not the politics, the CP before minoxidil?)

 

[Cassin]

Some sort of possible release of a harmful gas to the follicle right Bryan?

 

[jh]

I'll wait for clarification on the issue of harmful gas.


By the way, what do you make of Pickart's claims that CPs reduce scalp DHT levels? Here are two direct quotes from his website:

"Using 5-Alpha Reductase Inhibitors to block DHT production
The drug Propecia and natural copper ions in SRCPs are both potent inhibitors of DHT"

"Also, even modest increases in copper in the skin produces over 90% reductions in the production of DHT, the hair growth inhibiting hormone."

 

[Snarfleflous]

ok, so I should be applying Folligen BEFORE the minoxidil, and then like only every other day?

 

[blaze]

Also, I use CP's about 2 or 3 times a week. Sometimes I wonder if I use it enough to be effective. I do rub it into my scalp for a good minute so I know the cp's are getting absorbed into my scalp but is my scalp getting enough cp's in terms of frequency? I don't know.

From what I have read Cassin, concerning CP's you need to use them more frequently than what you are using them for any real benefit. Esp. since tricomin isnt even at the FDA trial strength. I would use Tricomin everyday if I were you. I use to use Tricomin too, and I use to add some DMSO to mine with every application because CP's are hard to get threw to the follicle. Thats why Pickart recommends using Emu after applying Folligen.

Not only that, he recommends watering down his solution in distilled water if you find it too strong.

It has more CPs than Tricomin. I have switched to Folligen, but it is much more messy than Tricomin and it really burns my scalp somtimes. I mix my Folligen with Emu Oil upon every application...this helps greatly.

Using folligen EOD is only to help reduce any irritation, as Folligen is a very powerful topical. Plus Pickart reckons ppl have emailed him saying they have been seeing better results with the EOD approach. Probably because their scalp couldnt handle ED application.

***As a side note Pickart is currently working on a new version of Folligen. I think he may be incorperating some of Tricomins peptide(GHK) since the patent has expired. I just hope it is more cosmetically acceptable than Folligen is ATM. I also notice Folligen seems to stain your fingernail slightly too. The green will go away after a couple of showers, but its still a hassle.

 

[SnowRider22]

I use Tricomin and it seems to be doing good so far. How do you mix it with Emu Oil and apply it? Also, there is better absorption when you do this?

 

[Cassin]

Keep in mind I only use Copper Peptides for scalp health. Not regrowth.

 

[Bryan]

I find it fascinating that Dr. Pickart was reported to have said that it might actually be better to apply Folligen every other day, rather than every day!

So what do you think Bryan...am I wasting my time by going at the minimal application approach?

No. I'd probably take Dr. Pickart at his word on that, especially considering that even Dr. Proctor seems to have a similar fondness for using things somewhat intermittently!

Bryan

 

[Bryan]

Well, I used to apply Minoxidil first but Bryan claims Copper Peptides need to go first so I go by what he says (unless it his politics .

Well, I used to worry that minoxidil would release nitric oxide while it was being metabolized in the skin, and the nitric oxide would then react with any superoxide that was hanging around to form the highly toxic and dangerous peroxynitrite; for that reason, I thought it was preferable to knock-out the superoxide FIRST with the copper-peptides, then apply the minoxidil a little while later.

However, Dr. Proctor then told me that minoxidil does NOT promote the formation of peroxynitrite. It's a nitric oxide mimetic, it doesn't actually release nitric oxide, so that worry was apparently unfounded. However, I still think it's probably better to apply the copper-peptide first, let it dry some, and then apply the minoxidil. The minoxidil needs to sit on the scalp undisturbed.

Just to be honest, though, I must admit that Dr. Proctor himself says it probably doesn't make much difference which order you apply these things.

I typically apply my CP's....wait about an hour or whenever and apply my roagine foam.

Sounds like a good plan to me.

Bryan

 

[jh]

Any opinion on Pickart's claims that DHT levels are dramatically reduced when copper peptides are applied?

Here are direct quotes (again):
"Using 5-Alpha Reductase Inhibitors to block DHT production
The drug Propecia and natural copper ions in SRCPs are both potent inhibitors of DHT"

"Also, even modest increases in copper in the skin produces over 90% reductions in the production of DHT, the hair growth inhibiting hormone."

Is the skin in the scalp any different from skin elsewhere?

 

[Bryan]

I'm very very dubious of Dr. Pickart's claim about copper peptides and DHT "inhibition", although I admit that I can't directly refute it with references to the literature.

Bryan

 

[JWM]

It's strange though that for the past several years Pickart has claimed that the best results from his clinets have been applying minoxidil first, wait a few minutes, then apply Folligen.

Personally, I feel that since Folligen doesn't contain alcohol it would make sense to apply that first and apply minoxidil afterwards so the alcohol in the minoxidil could help the Folligen absorb better. But hell, if the previous method has been working for Pickart's folks all these years then who am I to judge?

 

[Snarfleflous]

Okay, well how about I hedge my bets like this:

Night 1: Apply minoxidil first. Let dry two hours. Apply Folligen.
Night 2: Apply folligen. Let dry. Apply minoxidil.

And so on.

 

[Bertie]

***As a side note Pickart is currently working on a new version of Folligen. I think he may be incorperating some of Tricomins peptide(GHK) since the patent has expired. I just hope it is more cosmetically acceptable than Folligen is ATM. I also notice Folligen seems to stain your fingernail slightly too. The green will go away after a couple of showers, but its still a hassle.

Interesting. I figured that Pickart would basically combine the Tricomin peptide with the Folligen solution as soon as he could legally do so, but I didn't know the patent had expired yet. May I ask where you heard this?