Considering Testosterone cycle

[x5o]

Just wanted to throw this out - I have avoided Testosterone supplementation because of the concerns that I had on its effect on my hair loss. However, now with dutasteride. and Proscar, I'm considering doing a heavy cycle thinking that I could avoid any of the neg. side effects. Anyone ever try this? My thinking is also that between the dutasteride. and Proscar I could avoid the acne as well. Risky I know, but I'm about to take the plunge. I have done light cycles before and they do wonders for me physically and emotionally. Any thoughts or experiences would be welcome.

I would be remiss if I did not caution younger people from avoiding testosterone and other steroids completely. I'm "older" and my levels are lowering by the year. Also, being fully grown there are no growth stunting issues with me - yeah, that's right young people, steroids like test. can stunt your growth. Don't even think about doing them if you aren't over 25 and getting them legally from a Doctor. Black market steroids abound and often times are complete junk or the real deal that has been destroyed from smugglers who could care less about temperature while transporting.

 

[Guest]

Just wanted to throw this out - I have avoided Testosterone supplementation because of the concerns that I had on its effect on my hair loss. However, now with dutasteride. and Proscar, I'm considering doing a heavy cycle thinking that I could avoid any of the neg. side effects. Anyone ever try this? My thinking is also that between the dutasteride. and Proscar I could avoid the acne as well. Risky I know, but I'm about to take the plunge. I have done light cycles before and they do wonders for me physically and emotionally. Any thoughts or experiences would be welcome.

I would be remiss if I did not caution younger people from avoiding testosterone and other steroids completely. I'm "older" and my levels are lowering by the year. Also, being fully grown there are no growth stunting issues with me - yeah, that's right young people, steroids like test. can stunt your growth. Don't even think about doing them if you aren't over 25 and getting them legally from a Doctor. Black market steroids abound and often times are complete junk or the real deal that has been destroyed from smugglers who could care less about temperature while transporting.

If you "do a cycle" now, you will never really isolate the impact of your new male pattern baldness related interventions on your hair loss.

One variable at a time is the more scientifiic approach, no?

:lol:

 

[Hair Dr.]

Did a cycle of test enathat about 2 months ago, it did cause more hair loss but not that bad i only did a 4 wk. and only 1cc a week to see the effects.
i also tried deca durabolin last summer because it was supposed to be the safest for the hair. i will tell you i only took 1.5cc twice a week for two weeks and i could not control the hairloss, it was so bad i freaked out, i will never ever touch that sh*t again, i have since grew back the hair that was lost but the little gains i got were not worth it.

 

[x5o]

Thanks for the reply Doctor. I am surprised at what you experienced with the Deca. I too had been under the impression that it had the least neg. side effects. It is widely understood though that you cannot beat the gains from test. (enanthate or cypionate) I.M. I have done cycles with one or two shots per week of 200 mg. per ml enanthate for up to 8 weeks and could never really determine if loss of hair increased. I did find that I would get cystic like zits after a while. They cleared after the cycle. My wife (now ex) did tell me my temper was worse during the cycle. Gains were good though and although I lost the water retained from the cycle after a few weeks, I kept about 50% of the mass gained and about 80% of strength gains. I was considering 1 1/2cc (200 mg per ml) every third day for about 5 weeks just to see the results. My unscientific guess is I would make huge gains (if I eat and lift right during the time) and have a few zits. I am thinking my current "heavy duty" hair regimine will protect my follicles and an antibiotic will decrease the breakouts. Playin' with fire, yeah, I know - just another adrenaline junky here. I'd be curious to know more about the cycles you've done and your general lifting routine. I believe in HEAVY free weights, lots of protien, lots of lean red meat, and a lot of rest. Betagen is excellent also although I have heard that HMB has a neg. affect on hair. I may go for it when I have a full five week period to really devote to it and after the Dutesteride has gotten into my system more. I'll do before and after pics. and measurements and let you know how it goes.

 

[Hair Dr.]

i lift big, and heavy,protein 300-400 grams per day, eat every2.5-3 hrs.
i also tried prohormones in the past as long as you od on them they seem to work. if you do decide to try them stay away from products like 1-test they are derived from DHT that means they are already dht they are not converted to dht, so dust, and propecia wont work to stop the hair loss,
also if you take dust./or propecia with deca or 19 norandro your hair loss will become worse,

 

[x5o]

Whoa! 300 to 400 grms. per day! Damn son, that ain't no joke. What kind? I try for a variety of protiens but prefer the slower digesting ones like caseinate or milk protiens unless I'm consuming them after a work out where I want rapid digestion and availability. Post work out is whey protien all the way. How much do you weigh eatin' all that protien? And what do you consider heavy for working out (not maxing)...............75 lb. dumbells? 250 bench? 600 squat machine? Just curious. I'm always pickin' peoples brains for their routines. Like I said before, low reps. extra heavy weights for me. That's where I see my best gains. Because I can be lazy sometimes I'm looking into static weight training. You only do it once per week. I've have read some testimonials that seem pretty legit. The principles that it is based on make sense as well.

As far as "supplementation" is concerned, straight test. for me buddy. The original, the best. Can't touch it with anything out there as far as I'm concerned. And, I do believe it is safe. Hell, test. levels vary by hundreds of points in healthy individuals. Spiking your levels for a short period of time is just giving yourself a little genetic punch. As long as you don't stay on it so long that your body completely shuts down it's manufacture of it you should be fine. Clomephene Citrate (spell?) helps when coming off of a cycle to jumpstart your own prod. of test. but clomid as it is commonly called is expensive$$$$$$$

 

[DonLapre]

Like I said before, low reps. extra heavy weights for me.

Go to http://www.ast-ss.com and sign up for the Max-OT program. You will fit in nicely....they are the best company ever! It is totally free, also they make the best supplements on the market. The way the structure the workouts reallt make sense...it seems most people I know overtrain, but I never get sore but make constant gains. Like 300 pound deadlift and such....

 

[x5o]

Thanks. I'll check them out.

 

[Hair Dr.]

whey protein for after workouts mixed with 100% grape juice. about 4-5 meal replacement shakes, the rest chicken, steak, ground burger, my weight now is about 190, i lift 4-8 reps 6-9 sets. i only workout each body part once a week, i donot know my max because i workout alone at home i have a pretty cool setup. i bench 225 or more depending on how i feel, i want to start getting lean for the summer so i might do some running. as long as i eat i grow, if i slack on the protein i can really tell. i also include pasta when i can for the carb rush.

 

[douggie]

i also tried deca durabolin last summer because it was supposed to be the safest for the hair. i will tell you i only took 1.5cc twice a week for two weeks and i could not control the hairloss, it was so bad i freaked out,

I have researched steroids for quite a long time now. I was never against them, but I never did them since I did not know much about them. Now that I know about them, I won't take them for the simple fact that i want to get my hair back first. Anyway, your problem with the deca was more a result of the finasteride than the deca. 5-ar reduces deca to a less potent androgen. So by taking finasteride, you were preventing the deca from becoming less androgenic and thus, speeding up your hair loss. it is a known fact that you should never finasteride with nandralone.

As for testosterone, I originally thought that 5ar was more than likely the limiting factor in DHT formation. It seems that some people still lose their hair from a test only cycle with finasteride which leads me to believe that there is more to this than I originally thought. Maybe excess test can bind to the hair follicles as well or maybe increasing test levels also increases 5ar levels. I don't know for sure, but I would choose which is more important to you, your hair or your body and go from there. To be completely honest, I would never attempt a cycle unless I had already reached my genetic potential.

By the way, I am and know a bunch of people that are steroid-free and over 200 lbs with little bodyfat. Work your *** off in the gym for a few years and then choose the alternative route later.

 

[x5o]

Interesting stuff. You seem pretty knowledgable. Never heard about what you posted regarding the Deca. Relative to the test. I believe the reason some still lose hair is that the proscar only blocks the type 2 5ar whereas the type 1 has a higher affinity for the scalp. (I may have the types reversed, but you get the point) I am thinking of the cycle simply because I have started dutasteride. which blocks types 1 and 2 5ar. The test. doesn't do your hair in the DHT does. With dutasteride. touting 98% DHT erradication I'm figuring I'll be OK. Let me know what you think. Also, I was thinking about NO2, but given the fact that NO2 works like minoxidil. which I have had bad shedding reactions to I'm thinking the NO2 could make my hairloss worse, plus I'm still trying to figure out if it is a gimmic.

 

[douggie]

NO2-It's a gimmic, I wouldn't really touch the stuff.

As for postcycle, Nolvadex is cheaper and better than Clomid.

Also, I hear Cypionate hurts like hell when you inject it.

 

[x5o]

C'mon Dougie,

You can't just leave me hangin' with that. Pray tell more. What have you heard about the NO2? Do you know of any sites with workout forums or chats? Also, what do you know about Nolvadex compard to the Clomid?
I like Clomid - used it - can't say you can feel anything to know it's really working, but given it's an RX, I feel that it was probably doin' it's job. As for cypionate it is my understanding that it is the same as enanthate. Both are oil based and "cleaner" than water based testosterone. I like em' because they are more stable and longer lasting in the body and they are a natural compound already found in the body. Enanthate didn't really hurt at all, although because they are oil based you need a larger needle. Maybe that's where the pain rumor came from. Let me know what you think.

 

[VoRteX]

n02 is basically a ripoff.

If you want to take something that works, creatine monohydrate with some dextrose post workout is good. Also the new volumizers with tri-creatine malate and arginine such as san V12 and Swole v2 are getting rave reviews from people that prevously didnt get much gains from creatine.

I have enough prohormones to do at least 5 cycles. I have never touched them yet. I may never touch them. I have the most potent legal steroid in my possession - methyl 1test. It totally bypasses the liver and is so potent people are gaining on 10mg/day ORALLY. Do a search at bodybuilding.com on it. People are gaining 10lbs in 2 weeks on the stuff. I probably will do my first cycle with transdermal 19nordiol and trandsdermal 4ad with transdermal formastat for e-control and 6oxo post cycle. I also have nolva if I need it.

Then again, I may never touch any of that stuff because I'm getting pretty good gains using creatine, whey, eating right, and doing HIIT cardio

When I get do my goal bodyfat, I might try the nordiol cycle. It doesnt convert to DHT so its supposed to be the safest. However, many people lose hair from any androgens. I personally believe that other androgens besides DHT can effect the follicles. Therefore, nothing is completely safe.

I would say the best precautionary measure is to take a moderate dose and use spironolactone twice a day as an androgen sheild.

 

[DonLapre]

I've been working out solidly for about 1 year now, and I have experienced pretty big gains using the Max-OT system. My diet was a bit haphazard before, but for about the past 3 months I have stuck with my plan. I eat exactly 390 grams of protein, 272 grams of carbs, and about 40 grams of fat. I get most of my protein through whey and red meat (lean steak). I use the Max-OT system which is 6-9 total heavy sets, 4-6 reps per set, and workout only 1-2 body parts per day spread out mon-fri. I take creatine and plenty of vitimins A E and C. I drink between 1 to 2 gallons of water each day, and use a recumbent bike for about 45 mins per day, 2 sessions one 15, and the other 30. I wait for at LEAST 6 hours after lifting before I ride the bike. I try to eat most of my protein in the 3 hour post workout window (go to http://www.ast-ss.com).

Now if I my freaking propecia and rogaine would get here I would be happy!

 

[Hair Dr.]

used the no2 worked for about a week, the best thing i have tried is plasma expander by VPX sports, huge pumps, last all day but the sh*t is like $65.00 for 2.5-3 pounds, as far as deca and pro. or dust. deca aromatises
(spelling ?)on the scalp it is converted to a weaker androgen, at least weaker than dht, so by using dust. or pro. it prevents it from converting to the weaker form. but i think something, estidiol or something caused the massive shed.

 

[douggie]

http://www.ironmagazine.com is a great lifting forum, as is http://www.avantlabs.com

I suppose if you are going to get technical, I have used Methyl 1-Test for 3 weeks. I don't really think it is a steroid, but it worked very well. I would look to lose a fair amount of hair on this stuff if you do try it.

I group NO2 into a group of supplements such as ZMA that are only good if you are deficient in whatever is in them, which, unless you are in a 3rd world country, probably is not the case.

 

[BadHairDecade]

Unless you guys are competing and under a doctors care, stay off the juice....It was the single most regretable thing I've ever done in my life. It'll catch up with you. That's all I have to say.